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couchmaster
climber
pdx
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Topic Author's Original Post - Oct 12, 2013 - 08:11am PT
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Was up?
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dirtbag
climber
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Oct 12, 2013 - 09:02am PT
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really?
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5.samadhi
climber
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Oct 12, 2013 - 09:05am PT
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the government is providing a "marketplace" to monitor prices and force health insurance companies to reduce their premiums based on each individual's income.
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5.samadhi
climber
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Oct 12, 2013 - 09:35am PT
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yeah because here in the USA we pay so much more taxes already than other countries a 2.5-7.5% tax on our income for healthcare is unjust :D :D :D
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Sierra Ledge Rat
Mountain climber
Old and Broken Down in Appalachia
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Oct 12, 2013 - 09:48am PT
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The health care insurance companies earned over $12 billion dollars in profits.
They make profits by denying payments and cancelling the insurance of sick people.
With that $12 billion they bought the Republican party and launched a smear campaign to make people think that Obamacare is something that it's not.
Getting everyone into the insurance pool is the most fiscally-responsible strategy for our nation. How can the Republicans object to fiscal responsibility?
Don't want to pay for someone else's healthcare? Guess what genius - you already are. You're paying for other people's health care through a system that is convoluted, inefficient and unfair that does nothing but keep sick people sick, keeps poor people from getting care until they're almost dead, and makes insurance company CEOs rich.
I am a healthy man in my 50s and a small business owner, but I cannot get health insurance at any price. Me, and millions of other like me, are one accident or one major illness away from financial destitution and bankruptcy. How fiscally responsible is that policy? Obamacare will end this travesty.
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Reeotch
Trad climber
4 Corners Area
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Oct 12, 2013 - 10:29am PT
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In America, which is the dead last developed country to officially establish universal health care, the new health law tries to make every part of the system profitable – for doctors, hospitals, insurers, pharmaceutical companies, medical equipment manufacturers, etc.
And, where are all these profits going to come from? When we allow a for-profit entities into the mix, how is that supposed to make things more affordable? Isn't this like just taking our tax money and giving it to some absurdly rich CEO. That money is not going to health care, its going in to private bank accounts.
But, allowing the government to administer the healthcare system, well that's socialism! What do you call Obamacare? Profitism?
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Sierra Ledge Rat
Mountain climber
Old and Broken Down in Appalachia
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Oct 13, 2013 - 01:13pm PT
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And, where are all these profits going to come from? When we allow a for-profit entities into the mix, how is that supposed to make things more affordable? Isn't this like just taking our tax money and giving it to some absurdly rich CEO. That money is not going to health care, its going in to private bank accounts.
Good question.
If you buy into American capitalism, then the partly-line answer is this: When incentivized, private companies can do a better job than government at providing services at an overall lower cost. The incentive is a carrot of guaranteed profits. So it's a win-win situation with people getting better services at an overall lower cost, and the companies providing the services get to become rich.
However, I can tell you from experience (I work in the healthcare field) that capitalism and business models do not work in healthcare. The primary reason is the "Law of Unintended Consequences." Capitalism and business models generate a whole host so extremely harmful motivations that are destroying healthcare.
Example of an extremely harmful motivation? Drug addicts can go to any ER and demand fist-fulls of narcotics, and because they're "customers" like anyone else they walk out with fist fulls of narcotics. If the doctor doesn't give the "customer" what they want, the hospital CEO (with an MBA) terminates the doctor's hospital privileges due to "poor customer service." There thousands and thousands of other examples that clearly show that healthcare is not, and should not be, business. Times are changing.
What worked in the past isn't working anymore, and the business model will certainly lead to the downfall of healthcare. So many people's brains are so entrenched in the idea of capitalism that they are going to ride the capitalism train to hell. They won't even realize their mistakes until they hear Satan himself hollering "Last stop! Please disembark!"
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couchmaster
climber
pdx
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Topic Author's Reply - Oct 13, 2013 - 09:01pm PT
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Dirtbag said: "really? '
Really.
What am I suppose to be doing?
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Outside
Trad climber
Truckee
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Oct 13, 2013 - 09:31pm PT
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Seems to me everyone needs to have insurance , just like for cars, the insured are now paying for the un-insured.
My insurance policy has gone down 15% with Obc.
It's about time !
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Snowmassguy
Trad climber
Calirado
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Oct 14, 2013 - 12:05am PT
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Well my family policy went up 250% so Obamacare is the only option. Obviously the insurance company's way of ditching my family. Looks like I will pay about $7200 more per year and my deducible will go from $2500 to $5000.
So...$10K more per year for the same care ( hopefully). That is approx. 10K that I will not be spending in my community. If my small business does not grow this year, I will likely have to lay off an employee. We will see....
Good times.
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couchmaster
climber
pdx
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Topic Author's Reply - Oct 14, 2013 - 11:35am PT
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So, if you have insurance but haven't registered on the exchanges, when tax time comes, are you paying the penalty because you didn't register?
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HermitMaster
Social climber
my abode
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Oct 14, 2013 - 12:55pm PT
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I just signed up my inflatable sheep and got the "Clinton Discount"
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Wade Icey
Trad climber
www.alohashirtrescue.com
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Oct 14, 2013 - 12:55pm PT
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Unkown as to why a male may need maternity leave- or pediatric needs..
that's quite a stretch even for you ron.
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Wade Icey
Trad climber
www.alohashirtrescue.com
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Oct 14, 2013 - 01:03pm PT
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too clever to be RJocks or LEB. Not abrasive enough to be Fatty or Coz...
definitely a first time poster just wanting to discuss health care on a climbing website..happens everyday...
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Brandon-
climber
The Granite State.
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Oct 14, 2013 - 03:05pm PT
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Yeah, it sucks that more people are going to have health care soon.
How dare we? We are going to stifle health care providers main concern. Profits.
That's un American!
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Gary
Social climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
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Oct 14, 2013 - 03:42pm PT
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No, you wouldn't've caved by now!
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pyro
Big Wall climber
Calabasas
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Oct 14, 2013 - 05:45pm PT
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keep it going ron!
which state offers the best health care product/package?
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HermitMaster
Social climber
my abode
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Oct 14, 2013 - 06:13pm PT
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yahhhh exactly what a 55 yr old fixed single male needs,,, maternity coverage....FOR HIMSELF..
Ron's discussion seems entirely reasonable......
Why should people be forced to pay for overpriced insurance they will never use?
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rottingjohnny
Sport climber
mammoth lakes ca
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Oct 14, 2013 - 06:16pm PT
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What happens if dumb f*#k Ron gets knocked up..? He won't be dissin the ACA then...Will he..?
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HermitMaster
Social climber
my abode
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Oct 14, 2013 - 06:22pm PT
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And once we get rid of the repub party, we'll have it.
Obamacare was won without a single Republican vote. Exactly what the hell are you talking about?
More importantly: Obama didn't give us Universal Healthcare. He gave us a healthcare system where each and every American is expected to purchase over priced and unneeded insurance from private companies.
But, you keep pretending, Smudge.
LOL!!!!!
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