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Douggie
Social climber
California
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Topic Author's Original Post - Mar 7, 2013 - 03:25pm PT
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Rent in arrears, car acting up, cat is sick, and mostly my partner is not getting better health wise. I'll get her into State care, I'll sell off everything, and then a bottle of Powers and a kayak into the sea.
I used to be the eternal optimist.
Stress does take its toll. Many of you Supertopians are stronger than I am. Pat (Oliver/Ament), BVB, and others who are also struggling, I'll think of you. I am going to paddle into the sunset.
I don't know, things are just not working, and I do not want to pull my partner down with me. She belongs in care for her own health, everybody says I have been doing a good job, yeah... why am I skint, why can't I pay the rent, why am I near meltdown. No, I have done a lousy job.
I am not feeling sorry for myself, I hope. I thought I could make it work. I've done a lousy job.
I'd like to think that I could still lead 5.11, hell, I can't even lead myself.
I know that I sound like a crybaby, and I know there are Taco Standers in more dire straits than I am in. But the wind has been taken from my sails. If I had a decent set of cajones, I'd weather this spell, but I don't know, I just want to cry. So I am a crybaby.
Kayak, bottle of whiskey and the sunset... an easy option. I just don't know. I am conflicted.
If the sun would shine, if the rock was dry, if I went bouldering/free soloing in the morning, maybe my attitude would change. But... I feel helpless.
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G_Gnome
Trad climber
Pebble Wrestling.... Badly lately.
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Yep, I think most people have been there at one time or another. Wait a week and if this is what you still want...
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Spider Savage
Mountain climber
The shaggy fringe of Los Angeles
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Spring will come.
Just resolve some little things one at a time.
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John M
climber
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Hey Man, Please don't make any longer term decisions until you have gotten your wife the care she needs. And maybe think about cutting yourself some slack. Caring for a sick partner is one of the hardest things that we can do. Especially if finances are tight. Or just plain broken. I haven't had to take care of someone else. My own experience is with my own health and having to deal with losing everything. Its hard. Its very hard. So please cut yourself some slack. Get her the help she needs and then get yourself out into the sunshine. There is no shame in needing help contrary to what some of the hardasses who likely have never faced something like what you are going through.
Take a deep breath man. I will pray that you find the strength and wisdom and the help that you could use right now.
John
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Douggie
Social climber
California
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Topic Author's Reply - Mar 7, 2013 - 04:16pm PT
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Dudes, thanks for your responses. I am trying. I used to think I was strong, but it looks like I am weak. I never thought that, not that I am macho or anything, but I always had the strength of conviction. But as with many people nowadays, in the economic times, times are tough, and a partner (not wife, but she may as well be, we've been engaged for over five years... I proposed on a sunny day overlooking the Blasket Islands), sometimes I just want to throw my hands in the air and give up.
I guess I am a chicken sh#t. Really, at times, I just want to cry, but I can't. I have to try and be level-headed, but deep down, I wonder.
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Douggie
Social climber
California
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Topic Author's Reply - Mar 7, 2013 - 04:25pm PT
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Okay, just to show how a gormless chicken sh#t I am, I imagine that you know who I am and that I started a new name/avatar because...
...because I... don't want to show my weakness.
I thought I could weather the storm, but I am breaking down. I started out as DPatrick, and now I am Douggie. How pathetic am I? No answers please, as there are no prizes to be won. So save the stamp on the postcard.
My dream? To win the EuroMillions and climb both the Nose and Salathé Wall. Got up to Mammoth Terraces back in 1976... and bailed.
I just want to do what is best for my partner.
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labrat
Trad climber
Auburn, CA
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One step, one task, one day at a time. Sometimes they seem overwhelming. You can do it...
Erik
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John M
climber
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You are on a long unrated climb. It can't be rated because you don't even know where the top is. So if it can't be rated, then why give yourself sh#t for struggling. What you have to do is learn how to just give in to the moment and also how to take care of yourself. For instance, the mind is a funny thing. Once a thought takes hold it can take on a life of its own creating pathways in your mind which make it seem truer and truer, even if its not true. " can't make it" is one of those kinds of thoughts. Since you don't know where the top of the climb is, then the thought that you can't make is is just untrue. You have no real idea of what you are capable of. What you do know is that you need some help dealing. One place to find help is with the doctors. Our system is set where some forms of help only kick in when the person is near complete collapse. Which is a point that really bugs me because I believe that people could contribute a lot more to their own recovery if they just had a bit more help in the beginning. But we wait until they are nearly helpless. But thats beside the point. The point is that there is help out there, it just doesn't kick in until you bottom out. Becoming suicidal is the bottom. Please tell your friends docs that you have been having these thoughts. even if hope you don't really do it. Thats not the point. The point is that you are having them and that is something that needs to be dealt with. It will open up more resources for you and with those resources you may find you can continue the climb. Sometimes all a person needs is a breather. Some times they need more help.
It also helps to unburden yourself at times. Sometimes the taco can be a mean place to put yourself out there like that, but it will also reveal that there are people who care. Even if the only thing that they can offer is a listening ear.
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this just in
climber
north fork
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A good saying is "I've seen worse things happen to better people" Humble yourself and focus on the good things in your life. You never know what's around the corner. Good luck man.
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Douggie
Social climber
California
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Topic Author's Reply - Mar 7, 2013 - 04:47pm PT
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eKat, labrat, SCseagoat, JohnM, this just in
Okay, the Douggie handle is out. I have been Patrick Sawyer for years on the Taco Stand. I don’t know why I felt the need for a different handle… cowardice, shame or whatever.
But the advice you have given me shores me me up, so to speak. Thank you for your feedback.
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Patrick Sawyer
climber
Originally California now Ireland
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So, here I am in all of my not so glorifying... um, glory. No more Douggie.
Dave Kos, great video.
I am sorry to pollute the Supertopo forum with my despicable and sad posts. But I do not have many outlets. I left a message for the HSE psychologist, and I spoke with the public health nurse, John, about my 'concerns' (he asked me if I had been drinking), and John has been a super help to Jennie and myself.
I just have to keep my head up and work towards some solutions. But the feedback from you Taco Standers does help.
A down moment for DPatrick, Douggie and Patrick Sawyer.
Thanks all. I love you Supertopians.
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mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
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I can only warn you, Patrick, that "worse things happen at sea."
At least you were able to see the Mammoth Herd in '76, that's something...Not many of us got to see them. :)
Cheer the f*#k up! This is only a TEST or something. You can't cheat, either. It's an enduro run on skis. It will end. You'll be better for it and will have given her the love she apparently deserves at the finish line. That's your reward. Are you willing to accept that? Cuz it's all there is--what you do for love.
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John M
climber
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Hey Patrick. Its actually kind of a relief to know that there isn't another person who is also dealing with what you are dealing with. I was also thinking.. "hey, Patrick would have some advice for this guy". :-)
I have one more thought on the depression. If you haven't been dealing with depression for much of your life, then what you have is situational depression. Thats where a persons situation depresses their sense of well being. The good thing about that is once the situation is dealt with, it can be reversed. The bad thing is that if the situation is ongoing as yours is, then you need to deal with it so that it doesn't become entrenched.
One place to start dealing with it is to work on not beating yourself up. Sometimes berating oneself can motivate oneself to try harder, but that usually only works in the very short term. Like psyching ones self up to do something scary. But once a situation becomes long term, then it quickly becomes counter productive. It tears you down right when you need building up. You aren't a piece of sh#t. You just feel like one. You feel like one because you are dealing with one of the hardest things a person can deal with and its beaten you up pretty bad. I think its Jim who has a picture in a snow cave on a climb where he looks like death warmed over. I can't remember if that was right before they turned back, or if they went one, but I know how he felt in that moment. Its hard. Sometimes things are just bigger then we are. Its not a statement about how pathetic we are. Its a statement about how big other things are. This illness your partner has is big.
I'm sorry to say this, but I believe that your partner needs to be in state care. Her situation is more then one person can deal with. You have held out a long time, but now its time to turn her care over to a facility set up to handle her situation. My family went through this recently with an aunt. I know a little bit about how difficult it can be though my aunt has money. So we didn't face nearly the challenge that you have been facing.
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Hardman Knott
Gym climber
Muir Woods National Monument, Mill Valley, Ca
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Yep, I think most people have been there at one time or another. Wait a week and if this is what you still want...
This is really good advice.
At least 2 Golden Gate Bridge jumpers who survived (only 26 total out of 1700+) are on record stating that they regretted jumping the moment they let go of the rail, and that they fought to get their feet under themselves so that they could enter the water with the best chance of survival.
That really puts a point on the quote above from G_Gnome...
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graniteclimber
Trad climber
The Illuminati -- S.P.E.C.T.R.E. Division
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Caring for a sick partner is one of the hardest things that we can do. Especially if finances are tight. Or just plain broken. I haven't had to take care of someone else. My own experience is with my own health and having to deal with losing everything. Its hard. Its very hard. So please cut yourself some slack. Get her the help she needs and then get yourself out into the sunshine. There is no shame in needing help contrary to what some of the hardasses who likely have never faced something like what you are going through.
Word.
You need help.
Would the state be able to provide any help?
Do you have family or friends you can get help from?
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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Keep hanging on Patrick.
It's clear to everyone that you have NOT done a poor job.
There are no answers at the bottom of a bottle though.
Did someone say that the blues could help? Well, a lot of folks over the years have said so.
Let's try The Bluest Blues from our departed Alvin Lee. It's a killer track and may even be a little too close to the bone....
Peace Man.
[Click to View YouTube Video]
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Hardman Knott
Gym climber
Muir Woods National Monument, Mill Valley, Ca
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Patrick - you inspired me to find the stories of those GGB survivors. The first is Kevin Hines, who jumped in 2000. Here's an excerpt:
At the very moment Kevin Hines launched himself over the guardrail and plummeted toward the water below, he changed his mind: "Oh s -- ," he thought. "I don't want to die! What am I going to do?"
He plunged headfirst, gaining velocity until he was speeding far faster than the traffic above him crossing the Golden Gate Bridge. The distance from bridge to water is the equivalent of 25 stories, and he was conscious the whole way. The descent passed quickly, as if he were flying. Yet in mid-fall he was strong enough to turn his body into a sitting position, so he hit feet first. He sank beneath the calm, frigid water. Deeper and deeper. Far scarier than the screamingly silent fall was the darkness beneath the surface of the bay. The deeper he sank, the darker it became.
The pain was indescribable. The impact had broken his back and shattered vertebrae. And then he began, with the instinct for survival of any animal, to swim upward toward light and air. When he broke through the surface of the water he was stunned to be alive, and momentarily thought he was hallucinating. He tried to swim toward a bridge pylon, but his pain overwhelmed him and he began to sink beneath the water again, struggling against dying.
From:
http://www.sfgate.com/news/article/Lethal-Beauty-A-Survivor-s-Story-A-jumper-2598731.php#page-1
And here's a story on Ken Baldwin, the school teacher who jumped in 1985. Excerpt:
At 10 o'clock in the morning, Ken Baldwin walked calmly on to the bridge, and jumped straight over the rail. But as soon as his arms let go, he knew he'd made a mistake. Despite all his years of contemplating suicide, he knew that he didn't want to die after all. As he describes it, ‘I thought, What am I doing? This was the worst thing I could do in my life. I thought of my wife and daughter. I didn't want to die. I wanted to live.' He recalls realizing that ‘everything in my life that I'd thought was unfixable was totally fixable - except for having just jumped.'
From:
http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/out-the-darkness/201110/the-jumpers-what-happens-after-person-jumps-the-golden-gate-bridge-surv
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clode
Trad climber
portland, or
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Hi Patrick. Glad to see you're still posting here. As you have seen, a lot of the folks here have good, genuine hearts and care about people, you included.
I replied to one of your posts several weeks ago, and since then I've learned a lot about what society calls "mental illness". I hate that term, because it carries horrible stigma with it.
My wife's son has bipolar disorder, ADHD and PTSD. He is 30 and now in the State Hospital. To help us cope, we have joined the family-to-family group in the Portland area for NAMI (National Alliance for the Mentally Ill). In dealing with this, I prefer to use the term "physical condition". Just like diabetes, which is a physical condition, it requires medication for life to treat and live. My wife has Hashimoto's Hypothyroidism, for which she must take medication for life to treat and live. Her son must now take medication for life to treat and live. Unfortunately, he is not yet able to admit he has a "physical condition", so he's unwilling to take medication. Until he crosses that bridge he will not be able to function in society.
I don't know if there is a NAMI equivalent where you are, but you can still learn a lot by Googgling their web site. I encourage you to do so, because the more you learn and know, the more you'll be better able to cope. Plus you can gain support from others who have gone what you are now going through.
Hang in there, keep trying, and PLEASE, take time for yourself! You can't take care of others unless you take care of yourself. That's why the airlines say "put on your mask first, then help your child".
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Patrick Sawyer
climber
Originally California now Ireland
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I'm sorry to say this, but I believe that your partner needs to be in state care
I can't do that John M, there is still 'potential' there. I have to believe.
Graniteclimber, yes we do get great help. Jennie thinks that we would be better off in England (where her late husband, RIP 1990, was from) or in California - she loves San Francisco, but we do get free medical care here. She just not "get it".
She hates Ireland (her country) but we are getting better care here than in the States or Britain. But try telling her that.
I suppose the most depressing thing is that, she thinks she can go out and find a job - as a child minder, cleaning houses, working in a shop, or her dream, teaching disadvantaged children from the inner city ballet (she did get her honours in ballet from the Royal Academy of Dance in London, 1969. That speaks volumes.)
Her illness does not, will not, allow for her finding 'outside' work. I have to come up with a plan to keep her busy and feeling useful inside the home, but, the rent is in arrears and... what home will we have that is safe for her.
And if I have to leave a house/property that I stupidly put so much money in, and is just five minutes walk away from the rock (Dalkey Quarry)...
I have friend here, Bill, who grew up on a farm in Lancashire (and has a degree in horticulture/agriculture) who understands why I put money into this property, to try and give both Jen and myself a comfortable and safe place to live. But try telling that to the landlord.
I have to be the biggest fool ever.
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