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Dos XX
Trad climber
Los Angeles, CA
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Topic Author's Reply - Nov 22, 2011 - 12:39pm PT
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RE: Mtn Pass
It's great to see the US get back into producing its own Rare Earths.
True story:
I spent some time with the folks at Mt.Pass about 5 years ago when the whole operation was in suspension, due mainly to rare earths operations in China taking over the world market. Here's how that came about: in the mid 1980s a delegation of geologists and metallurgists came from China as part of the "warming up" of relations between the US and China. One stop on their tour of western US mining operations was a visit to the Rare Earth operation at Mt.Pass. The folks at Molycorp were proud of their mine and mill, and happy to help out their friends at the USGS who were sponsoring the Chinese. The visitors took copious notes and photos, with notable enthusiasm. Within 5 years China was developing some of the world's richest rare earths deposits, and within a decade Molycorp's operation at Mt.Pass was out of business.
A couple of years ago, I was contacted by a nice lady from the Riverside (CA) chamber of commerce, who asked if I knew anyone at Molycorp who could arrange a tour at Mt.Pass for some geologists and engineers from China. I politely explained to the woman why that wasn't gonna happen.
Edit:
It's not my intention here to rail against China, its people, or their mineral industry. It is Mother Earth who gave the planet's richest known rare earth deposits to the inhabitants of China. And for the record, Molycorp had some environmental mishaps at Mt.Pass which contributed to their decision to the mothball the operation in the mid-1990s. The conditions which contributed to the environmental issues have since been rectified.
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Klimmer
Mountain climber
San Diego
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Nov 24, 2011 - 02:29am PT
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When the Molycorp Mountain Pass mine was down several years ago, because of the cheap price of REEs from China, and also because of environmental compliance etc., the Fluorescent Mineral Society (FMS) did a field-trip there with permission.
http://uvminerals.org/fms/about-fluorescent-mineral-society
We got a great behind the scenes presentation by the company, got to see large vials of the different REEs separated by elemental oxide (patented processing, they didn't go into any detail on the process of oxide separation). Very colorful oxides and each glass container was extremely heavy (lots of mass).
Anyway, we got an all-day opportunity to go to several large tailings from the mine and look for great specimens of Bastnasite using our black plastic BBQ grill covers as insta-dark tents with powerful UV lamps in hand. The mineral is mined and then processed/separated into the different REEs, (LREEs and HREEs). Turns out that the mineral Bastnasite fluoresces nicely and very uniquely. I got a good deal of really good specimens. Very cool.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mountain_Pass_rare_earth_mine
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bastn%C3%A4site
We turned on the guys of the mine to the wonderful world of fluorescence. Hopefully they put a cabinet together with strong SW UV lamps for display for their visitors. Don't know if they did, but they realized how cool fluorescent minerals are by the time we left. Another Ooooh-Aaawwwee, for the collecting buck.
Our "Mine-to-Magnets" Business Plan
http://www.molycorp.com/AboutUs/MineToMagnets.aspx
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Jan
Mountain climber
Okinawa, Japan
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Nov 24, 2011 - 04:11am PT
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Surely one of the reasons we're in Afghanistan is that huge deposits of rare earths
have been found there - large enough to rival China's.
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ruppell
climber
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Nov 24, 2011 - 04:18am PT
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I don't mine(or mind) because I solo chalk less and bear foot. Also I do it close to home. Interesting thing is people chalk up on limestone.? Oh well to each their own
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Spider Savage
Mountain climber
The shaggy fringe of Los Angeles
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Nov 24, 2011 - 10:00am PT
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Nice post Klimmer!
Thankfully the USA has the Basin & Range for our mining and messy disposal facilities. In all the world it is a great resource. With the accordion action on the Earth's crust we get access to wonderful mineral & metal resources. AND with all those basins we have a reasonable place to dispose of our worst waste. It will take tens of millions of years for those basins to open up.
Better in our own back yard than someone else's.
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Klimmer
Mountain climber
San Diego
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Nov 26, 2011 - 02:30am PT
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Gold fascinates. It's money, it's ornamental, and it has incredibly important industrial uses. It is a very useful and unique element.
I think we should go back to a Gold standard for backing our money. It makes sense to me. Anyway . . .
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gold
Now we understand much about how the Solar System formed from a protoplanetary disk surrounding our newly born star ignited by fusion of H into He, about 5 Billions years ago. All elements, (indeed the entire Periodic Table) comes from stars that have gone Supernova. We are indeed made from "star dust." The planets accreted from dust, meteoroids, asteroids, planetesimals etc. pulling together and from violent continual bombardments. OK we know this, or we think we know this. It is our model.
But how did "The Royal Group," group (11) of the periodic table, especially Gold, come to be concentrated within our Earth's crust at the end of this process?
2 different understandings and theories:
Economic Geology-4350
A Brief Guide to the Geology Of Ore Deposits
By
Ron Morton
http://www.d.umn.edu/~pmorton/geol5350/2009/econclassnotes2009.pdf
Meteors Delivered Gold to Baby Earth, New Study Hints
Greenland rocks support theory for how our precious metals arrived.
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2011/09/110907-gold-metals-earth-meteors-oldest-rocks-nature-science/
8 September 2011 Last updated at 13:24 ET
Meteorites delivered gold to Earth
By Leila Battison
Science reporter
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-14827624
The original research paper:
The tungsten isotopic composition of the Earth’s mantle before the terminal bombardment
http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v477/n7363/full/nature10399.html
I think the truth is that both theories together are correct. The concentration of Gold in the Earth's crust is a little of both processes. Not any one theory of the 2 explains it all, in my opinion. But the two together explains much.
Googled: "Asteroids meteorites delivered gold to Earth"
http://www.google.com/search?q=asteroids+meteorites+delivered+gold+to+Earth&rls=com.microsoft:en-us:IE-Address&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&sourceid=ie7&rlz=1I7GPEA_enUS302
Very interesting. If this is how it happened on Earth, one of the 4 terrestrial planets, then it happened the same way for the other terrestrial planetary bodies as well, including our Moon and Mars.
"There's Gold in them thar meteoroids and asteroids, and even in them thar terrestrial like planetary bodies."
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Spider Savage
Mountain climber
The shaggy fringe of Los Angeles
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Nov 26, 2011 - 10:14am PT
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I don't think a return to the gold standard is a good idea.
It's a nice metal but why give it such artificial value?
Money is just a symbol for energy in fact not a symbol for matter. It represents the work that you do to obtain matter, not so much the matter itself.
I favor an advanced form of currency that is itself energy such as purely electronic currency.
The more we can build up civilization around a purely electro-magnetic system of communication and data storage, the softer we can tread on the Earth.
eg. Less gold mines. Look at all the chemical waste that is not happening thanks to digital photography, etc. etc.
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Klimmer
Mountain climber
San Diego
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Nov 26, 2011 - 12:37pm PT
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I think after we answer the question is there life off of Earth, on Mars, or some other place in our Solar System we will then be gearing up for natural resources. Its inevitable. In fact, I think we have already started.
I think we will at the least find microbial life on Mars and then even contemporarily. In fact, I think we already did back in the 70s with the Viking Missions. NASA and the US government is just too scared to admit it, or they have other nefarious reasons for delaying the truth. Read Dr. Gilbert V. Levin's (co-author) book, Mars The Living Planet.
Mars: The Living Planet [Bargain Price] [Hardcover]
Barry E. DiGregorio (Author)
http://www.amazon.com/Mars-Living-Planet-Barry-DiGregorio/dp/B005ZOFKI8/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1322330667&sr=8-1
Dr. Gilbert Levin's website:
http://gillevin.com/mars.htm
It’s Time to Realize There Is Life on Mars
Gilbert V. Levin
http://gillevin.com/Mars/EARTHComment_8=9-10.pdf
Remember, the Asteroid Belt is loaded with incredible resources (see NASA qoute posted before). You think we aren't going to go out there and get some? There is a race to the Moon now between many countries. Its gonna happen. And yes, there is a plethora of Gold out there and many other strategic and useful metals for all kinds of technology and clean renewable energy production. We need it in-situ for living off Earth primarily first, but I think eventually natural resources will come home to Earth also. It just makes sense once we figure out how to do it as cost effective as possible.
I think we already have the technology to do it. A very well known AF officer in the know once said, "We have the technology to take ET back home already."
We don't have to keep soiling and trashing our homeworld. No one is gonna miss a few asteroids. We need resources. Its gonna happen. I think sooner than later.
The MSL is on its way to Mars this morning (11-26-2011) . . .
NASA launches super-size Mars rover to red planet
By MARCIA DUNN | AP – 21 mins ago.
http://news.yahoo.com/nasa-launches-super-size-mars-rover-red-planet-150436037.html
Many cameras on-board the MSL are designed and built by Mike Malin’s MSSS company here in San Diego. Mike is a really, really interesting man. I wonder what secrets he knows about Mars. No one else on the face of Earth has more images of Mars and up close and in high resolution. And he spends unbelievable amounts of time looking over them with magnifiers and perhaps in stereo. The things he must have seen already . . .
Mike Malin: The Mars observer
How the reclusive Mike Malin changed the way that scientists view Mars.
Eric Hand
21 November 2011
http://www.nature.com/news/mike-malin-the-mars-observer-1.9402
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Rattlesnake Arch
Social climber
Home is where we park it
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Nov 26, 2011 - 03:57pm PT
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TGT
Social climber
So Cal
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Nov 26, 2011 - 10:06pm PT
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Last time there was a huge hub bub about undersea minerals and mining (Manganese nodules) it was all a cover story for snatching a Russian sub off the sea bottom. (Glomar Challenger)
What's the mystery motive this time?
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Nov 28, 2011 - 01:22am PT
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We visited South Pass, WY in Aug. Pretty cool place.
Carissa gold mine...
My favorite place...
Goebels Brewery poster - "Pure elixir"...
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Dos XX
Trad climber
Los Angeles, CA
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Topic Author's Reply - Nov 28, 2011 - 08:43am PT
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@reilly, that does look like a cool place. I've always wanted to stop and visit but never took the time. Thanks for sharing the pics.
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Klimmer
Mountain climber
San Diego
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Nov 30, 2011 - 11:57pm PT
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Now I love the romance of the Wild West and the incredibly interesting stories of the mining "Boom Towns" and the search for Gold, Silver and other precious metals, and all the adventure stories that go along with that. I'm a big fan of all the "Man with No Name" spaghetti westerns etc.
But it really is a crux issue between the need for natural resources, and the preservation of our incredible natural resources, history, and scenic wilderness.
Case in point . . .
Bodie.
I think we should preserve the incredible interesting historical resource we have there. I love visiting Bodie. And even though it is in an arrested state of decay it has an incredible story to tell when you visit and you have the place nearly to yourself off-season. It's quite, lonely, and desolate. You can just feel the ghosts of time there. Incredible place to visit and just wander around trying to feel how it must of been to be there in it's hey day. I wouldn't want to see it change, even though "there is Gold in them thar hills."
AUGUST 18, 2011
Gold Fever Stirs Ghost Town
Proposal to Ease Land Protections Could Clear Path for New California Mine
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424053111904070604576514482749037182.html
March 2008
The Technology of Mining Gold:
Introduction to Bodie’s Mineralogy
By
Michael H. Piat
http://www.bodiehistory.com/geology.htm
(I recall reading about/hearing about a portion of one of the mines deep in the hills of Bodie where they ran into rich concentrations of Gold in an excavated out "room of Gold." It was Gold all around on all the walls of the mined out excavated room. I would like to see images of that, but I haven't seen any. Not sure if any images of that "gold room" exist.)
Video: The Ecstacy of Gold: Bodie, CA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BwRM3yWmRKk
Great digital images of Bodie:
http://www.lovethesepics.com/2011/02/ghost-town-bodie-historic-state-park/
"If a Bodie Meet a Bodie and a Bodie's Dry, Let a Bodie Treat a Bodie, Let Him Treat with Rye."
California's Bodie apparently was one of the roughest "Shoot em Up" Western Boom Towns of its time.
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MikeL
climber
SANTA CLARA, CA
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TFPU, Reilly. (Takes one back in time.)
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