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| Messages 1 - 28 of total 28 in this topic |
Jello
Social climber
No Ut
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Feb 16, 2009 - 01:46am PT
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Holy Sh#t, Chris, yur gunna make wall crawler machines out of 'em. They do all that and the Nose will hold no secrets!
Just joking, really. What an amazing program to jump-start a wall-climbing career.
-Jello
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Mungeclimber
Trad climber
sorry, just posting out loud.
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Feb 16, 2009 - 04:31am PT
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If possible,
14. Rescue and retreat
[ ] practice rappelling with a haulbag
[ ] learn the basics of self rescue, how to escape the belay etc (material not covered in this book)
If possible??? Self rescue should be required even if not in the book. I feel like I never know enough about how to save my own bacon. John Dill wrote a masterful section for guidebooks on staying alive so I figure it is pretty important.
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altieboo
Boulder climber
Livermore, Ca
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Feb 16, 2009 - 04:33am PT
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Thank you for posting this Chris. It could not have come at better time.
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Gunkie
climber
East Coast US
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Feb 16, 2009 - 09:00am PT
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It's scary to think how little prep we did before doing the Nose 15 years ago.
You gotta add "crapping in a bag and wrestling with a poop tube." Also, pee first, then poop. That helps or maybe that's just me.
Just trying to be helpful.
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Paulina
Trad climber
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Feb 16, 2009 - 11:43am PT
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Great training list, thank you for posting!
But I wonder how realistic is this: each session is 2-3 hours. Sessions 1 & 2 (basic leading) require a total of about 50 laps over the course of 2 days, so an average of 25 laps per session. Presumably, the person starting out has done very little aid beforehand. I think a realistic estimate is 2-3 hours for like 2 maybe 3 laps on a bolt ladder... not 25!
I know that from personal experience being a total aid gumby, which is much closer in time to present day than Chris's :-).
Then of course the whole point is that you get more proficient and faster, but you should have some words in there about stretching out sessions, or taking (way) more than 2 sessions if needed.
Cheers!
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Josh Higgins
Trad climber
San Diego
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Feb 16, 2009 - 12:09pm PT
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I think that whole section is great in theory, but I honestly don't think that even 5% of people will do it. People are lazy and cocky. "I don't need to do that, that's for the other guy!"
Also, I agree that some of your time estimates are a little off. The less discouraging your program is, the more people will do it. Maybe at the beginning of the section stress HEAVILY that most people bail off The Nose due to lack of preparation. Real heavily, so that people have a larger incentive to do the training.
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SteveW
Trad climber
The state of confusion
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Feb 16, 2009 - 02:43pm PT
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Chris
Do you have a date in mind for publishing yet?
I'll bet there's tons of interest. . .
I can add quite a few pounds to that interest. . .
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Thorgon
Big Wall climber
Sedro Woolley, WA
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Feb 16, 2009 - 03:06pm PT
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Chris~
Yes, very timely, I have found a solid partner and have been climbing 4 times since mid-January! There are extremely good elements in your approach! One comment that I had, besides self rescue being a MUST, is that possibly each climbing group set their own time-goal! I am hoping that the outcome of this would be that teams could set a long term goal, get the training in, and still maintain their relationships, or jobs!
I have found it difficult to train and climb together with a partner! My last failed attempt on El Cap went SLOW beacause Jedi was training (super-fit) in Virginia, while I was training in Idaho! Then we hit the wall out-of-sync. In retrospect, I think we should have done The Prow first, then tackle The Cap, but time was an issue! We both had jobs to get back to.
In conclusion, If teams are allowed to follow the program and modify it to their unique situation, I feel a great amount of success could be achieved.. ESPECIALLY efficient change overs, leading in blocks, grouping pro while cleaning, etc. This information is detailed in Hans Florine and Bill Wright's book, "Speed Climbing, How to Climb Faster and Better"!!!!
Does that help?
Thor
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Prod
Trad climber
A place w/o Avitars apparently
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Feb 16, 2009 - 03:11pm PT
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Nice work.
Guy
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Redwreck
Social climber
Los Angeles, CA
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Feb 16, 2009 - 03:22pm PT
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I seem to be having some difficulty with the "become a 5.10b leader" part.
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Paulina
Trad climber
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Feb 16, 2009 - 04:17pm PT
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I know, and that's _before_ you start the training program. :-)
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Roger Breedlove
climber
Cleveland Heights, Ohio
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Feb 16, 2009 - 05:41pm PT
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That is great advice (and a great detailed plan) Chris--dial in the mundane work to enjoy the climbing.
However, I think my plan, 35-40 years ago, was to complete half of step 15, start 16, and finish with 14.
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GraemeK
Big Wall climber
Ontario
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Feb 16, 2009 - 08:18pm PT
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Hi Chris,
This is really great information. Honestly, one poster mentioned people might not want to do this - I most certainly DO! Rather than El Cap being an immediate goal, just becoming proficient is an immediate goal. I think your angle at the book is great - although the current books give ideas for getting up these things they seem to miss the basics around training and building up to it... More of this would be welcome (unfortunately I have no partners this year, but I can see where I can transition this to top-rope solo and practice on single pitch climbs - which may actually benefit me, to be honest).
Keep up the good work.
Rgds, Graeme.
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Studly
Trad climber
WA
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Feb 16, 2009 - 10:40pm PT
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I'm not sure I have a pencil big enough for the checklist for NIAD.
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labrat
Trad climber
Nevada
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Feb 16, 2009 - 11:22pm PT
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Thanks Redwreck
ditto on the 5.10B part. I was happy to cry my way up one 5.8 last summer.
Erik
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Ed Hartouni
Trad climber
Livermore, CA
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Feb 16, 2009 - 11:24pm PT
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think 5.10b french free leader....
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Paulina
Trad climber
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Feb 17, 2009 - 09:13am PT
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Ed, you're right, of course!
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altieboo
Boulder climber
Livermore, Ca
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Feb 17, 2009 - 08:58pm PT
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Thanks for the diagram Chris! I'm somewhere towards the end of the first month on that chart! Just need to get out there. Snow sucks....
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David Nelson
climber
San Francisco
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Feb 18, 2009 - 12:05am PT
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Chris, lots of fun, should achieve your goal of less bailing.
I think that you should also put in that they read John Dill's Staying Alive essay and maybe the thread here on ST that we all put together after the sad death of the two Japanese climbers, analyzing what went wrong. There are facts there that just don't appear elsewhere, such as considering communication with a ground party (I say "considering" because some felt that such a safety line compromised the essence of committing yourself; personally, I don't agree, but I am not trying to tell anyone how to do their thing, just open their mind to things they might not have thought of) and the fact that Camp VI is a waterfall in a what elsewhere on the Captain is a slight drizzle.
Cheers. Glad to see you are thinking climbing, not base jumping or worse, wingsuiting!
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TKW
Trad climber
Currently Nomadic
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Apr 17, 2009 - 10:12pm PT
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Hey chris (and others)
Do you have any rough guidelines for how fast is "fast" or "fast enough" (not talking hans/yuji speed here) for doing the nose at a nice clip (say 3 days)?
Eg roughly how many feet/min for leading c1, Following, etc.
How do I know when I'm going fast enough rather than just "faster than I used to go when I was slow". Obviously there are no hard and fast rules here but thoughts on ranges would be insteresting.
Thanks again for the inspiring roadmap - I think I may be somewhere around month 2.
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TradIsGood
Chalkless climber
the Gunks end of the country
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Apr 17, 2009 - 10:32pm PT
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Chris - You raise the bar on the genre.
Nice - I doubt I will ever get into aid climbing, but if I do, I'll know the first stop!
The guide books rock, too.
Maybe you should publish guides to other crags - held to your standards.
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Jon Byers
Trad climber
Boulder, CO
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Apr 19, 2009 - 09:08pm PT
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Hey David N.
Where is that thread you were referring to about the Japanese climbers?
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Tfish
Sport climber
La Crescenta, CA
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Apr 15, 2010 - 09:30pm PT
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You should add leading some trad pitches or aiding in the dark with a head lamp.
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JEleazarian
Trad climber
Fresno CA
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Apr 16, 2010 - 01:41pm PT
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Chris,
Holy Toledo -- you compressed my first six years of climbing into about six months! Nonetheless, it still looks like a good checklist (with the poop tube and French free comments).
John
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