Discussion Topic |
|
This thread has been locked |
| Messages 1 - 87 of total 87 in this topic |
GoMZ
Trad climber
Paradise
|
|
|
Topic Author's Original Post - Feb 5, 2007 - 05:32pm PT
|
I heard there was an accident yesterday in the Gorge. I was down there but did not hear or see anything. Does anyone have any details.
Steve
|
|
mini skirt
Ice climber
Bishop, CA
|
|
All I know was that it was fatal. Many bones were broken followed by cardiac arrest. My info is from the Search and Rescue guys.
|
|
WBraun
climber
|
|
Anybody know anything????
|
|
Lurking Fear
Trad climber
Bishop, California
|
|
Unfortunately the accident was fatal. My condolensces to the family and friends of the young man. Makes me wonder if climbing is worth the risk. Twenty six years of climbing and I still don't know the answer. Be safe, Andrew
|
|
GhoulweJ
Trad climber
Sacramento, CA
|
|
Any details as to what happened or who it was?
Very sad. I wish peace to the victim and strength to the survivors.
|
|
GoMZ
Trad climber
Paradise
|
|
|
Topic Author's Reply - Feb 6, 2007 - 12:59am PT
|
Oh man, I was hoping it wasn't true.
My condolences to the friends and family.
|
|
hummingbyrd
climber
|
|
I'm new to this forum, but have scouoring the internet trying to find out about a young friend who died somewhere in Inyo Cty? on Sunday - saw the posting about accident in Owns Gorge - sounds like the one: If so, he was 23 yrs old, from Appleton, WI, formerly from Waukesha, WI. Fell 110 feet, was breathing shallowly when his party got to him. Died either on way to hospital or in ER. Funeral will be Saturday in Appleton. I've known the family for over 35 years. Very sad. But, we will be reunited again, some day.
|
|
Magritte
climber
|
|
When I saw your sad note I called the Inyo Register. The Editor was kind enough to email what information she had. I'm including her email address:
climbing accident Inbox
"Darcy Ellis, Editor"
to me
More options 4:48 pm (1 minute ago)
This is all the information we have. Hope it helps.
Take care,
Darcy
Fatal fall in Gorge
A Wisconsin man is dead after falling an unforgiving 115 feet while
climbing in the Owens River Gorge over the weekend.
According to Captain Craig Williams with the California Department of
Forestry, which arrived on-scene about the same time as Symons
Ambulance, the victim fell about 4 p.m. from the popular China Wall in
the middle gorge, suffering major injuries in the process.
Mono County Sheriff’s Department Public Information Officer Shannon
Kendall said the man – identified by Inyo Coroner Leon Brune as Ian
Seevers Mack, 23, of Appleton, Wisc. – suffered multiple broken bones in
the fall and was taken by ambulance to Northern Inyo Hospital in Bishop.
Apparently, Mack was preparing to rappel down when he fell. He and a
climbing partner believed Mack was anchored to the gorge and it was as
the partner was preparing to take a photo of Mack that he suddenly fell,
Kendall said.
Climbers nearby reported hearing the call, “Off belay!” and responded
with a rescue litter to help get Mack to safety. Sadly, Mack’s injuries
proved too severe and he later died at the hospital.
The Inyo Register
Community newspaper for Inyo County. Published 3 times a week.
http://www.inyoregister.com/
|
|
WBraun
climber
|
|
Thanks for that information.
Huh? weird. Wonder if he was unclipped?
Condolences to all for the loss of Ian Mack.
|
|
Magritte
climber
|
|
Yes, condolences to his family and loved ones.
|
|
Hardman Knott
Gym climber
Muir Woods National Monument, Mill Valley, Ca
|
|
So sad.
God bless.
|
|
marky
climber
|
|
"115 unforgiving feet" is just awful. Granted, it's not the New York Times, but for christ's sake...
|
|
pud
climber
Sportbikeville
|
|
Sincere condolences to his family and friends.
Much too young to die.
|
|
Crimpergirl
Social climber
St. Looney
|
|
Very sad. I'm so sorry for those who knew him.
|
|
Mungeclimber
Trad climber
one pass away from the big ditch
|
|
Sometimes I feel like a tard checking others rig. The consequences are too great not to try.
|
|
Jaybro
Social climber
The West
|
|
Over the years I've made any number of mistakes that could have ended up this way. Be careful out there. Condolences to all involved.
|
|
Greg Barnes
climber
|
|
Condolences to friends & family - our thoughts are with you.
Somehow Bruce Lella survived a similar fall at Owens some years ago (from the top of the Pub Wall). Unfortunately, from that height few people make it, let alone climb again.
When I talked to a housemate in Bishop yesterday, he said that the fall was from the top of Love Stinks at the Banana Belt, but the article reports China Wall.
|
|
Jay
Trad climber
Fort Mill, SC
|
|
Been way too busy to hang around here lately, but I was excited to see Chris’s ST Newsletter in my inbox. The first thing I saw was this… not so excited anymore.
Hello to everyone, and be safe. Blessings to family and friends.
|
|
Jerry Dodrill
climber
Bodega, CA
|
|
Sorry to hear this news.
Those routes get soooo much traffic. I have to wonder about the integrity of the anchor and why he decided to rap vs. lower. Perhaps he just came un-clipped? This past fall I reached up to clip the anchor of Yellow Peril only to find the stainless FIXE biner worn completely through. Luckily there were three bolts and the others were decent looking Mussy Hooks. I put some cash in the box at Wilsons...
|
|
paganmonkeyboy
Trad climber
the blighted lands of hatu
|
|
My heartfelt condolences to the family and friends - very sad....
-tom
|
|
Greg Barnes
climber
|
|
Jerry, if he was on Love Stinks, there's about 25' of 3rd class to a ledge, then the climb is 101' or so off the ledge. So you can just barely rap to the ledge with most 60m ropes, but you can't lower to the ledge if belaying on the ground unless you have a 70 (and you can't make it back to the ground unless you have an 80 - yes, at least one local has an 80m).
An accident at Red Rocks a few years ago was reportedly the leader yelling "off belay!", then threading the rope through the chains, then leaning back and expecting to be lowered, while the belayer was off taking pictures. I harp on partners to not say anything when they get to the anchors if they're planning to get lowered, other than "slack" and "take" during the threading process. One reason why open anchors like Owens are nice - you avoid the untying and retying steps that you can mess up.
|
|
Hardman Knott
Gym climber
Muir Woods National Monument, Mill Valley, Ca
|
|
That anyone would lean back without first verifying tension on the rope is completely
boggling - I simply cannot picture it. Yes, I've heard of many accidents, including one
from a friend who felt the thud of a girl who fell 60 feet from the top of The Bubble
at Mt St Helena in the late 80's. I have never, ever, ever leaned back without
first grabbing up the rope tight to feel strong resistance, and I never, ever will...
|
|
Charles Perry
Big Wall climber
Fort Collins CO
|
|
To everyone and anyone,
Mungeclimber stated that he feels too much of a retard to check another climbers rig. If this is the case than I could quality for special education. A major point of safety in climbing is reduncancy. Check each other once, even twice. Rappelling off old slings or bad bolts which can be backed up with a stopper and a runner do it! I would rather loose twenty bucks backing up a rappel than take a chance loosing my life. I could go on and on about the situations I have read about and witnessed were a double check could have saved someones life. This accident could have possibly been avoided if the person at the upper anchors checked his system twice! I have witnessed more than once a situation in sport climbing were the leader believes the belayer is going to lower him and the belayer believes that the leader is rapelling! Without checking the situation the leader lets go and thank god in both situations has been able to catch the rope and save himself from a bad to fatal accident that would have been avoided with minimal communication. I morn for the loss of a comrade, our only hope as the living is to learn from others mistakes so we avoid them and gain a conscienceness were saftey is paramount. Let us live to climb another day.
|
|
Ksolem
Trad climber
LA, Ca
|
|
Very sad news. I enjoy climbing in the Gorge and go there frequently. It saddens me that this young man lost his life there..
Greg, I figured it had to be a situation like that when I saw the report specifying a fall of 115ft. When I read the initial report saying Great Wall Of China I wondered if maybe he was on Sendero Luminoso. Oh well, we'll know soon enough I'm sure...
It's easy to become complacent while sport climbing, bolts everywhere, taking whippers, everyone having fun.. Be careful out there folks.
|
|
Adamame
Trad climber
Oakland
|
|
I think I might have known this guy and was wondering if anybody could tell me anymore info. Is this the Ian who has lived at "The Pit" in Bishop frequently over the last year, while working construction jobs in Mammoth? I Believe this Ian also drove a silver Honda element, you know one of those boxey Toaster looking vans. For some reason I thought he was born a year later, but I might be wrong. If anybody can help me out let me know, and either way my heart goes out to his family and friends. It is allways a shame when we lose one of our tribe in such an unfortunate way.
|
|
WBraun
climber
|
|
Hardman Knott said it perfectly in his post up thread.
|
|
Jill Dworkin
climber
Fort Worth, Texas
|
|
Hey can anyone tell me how to get a hold of this guy's family...my family and I recently suffered a similar loss and I would like very much to contact them.
Thanks
|
|
Jello
Social climber
No Ut
|
|
Heartfelt condolences to family and friends.
-Jeff Lowe
|
|
BringYourOwnTR!
climber
|
|
OH MY FU*KING GOD!!!!! Why did he rap instead of lower?!!!! Are you kidding me??!!!! He rapped because that's what you're supposed to do! For all those that lower and TR off the anchors: YOU ARE THE REASON THE ANCHORS LOOK LIKE SH*T!!! How do you think the anchors get worn like that?...from people who TR and lower off them. It's called friction. TR-ing and (ESPECIALLY) lowering create a massive amount of friction on the anchors. You get enough people doing this on a day-to-day or week-to-week basis, like all the jack asses do in the gorge, then you get sh*ty anchors. I see WAY too many people out there that don't understand this concept and they are the fuc*ing problem. AND...the quick-link anchors that are there only encourage that unethical behavior. I see the same thing at Clark Canyon too.
I have been climbing for almost 10 years throughout the world and it's sad that so many climbers out there do this. At least if the anchors are not quick-links, then it helps force people to use their own top rope. My wife and I always use our own TR and the last person on the route ALWAYS raps off, so no extra friction is put on the anchors. If more people did this, then there would not be the constant need for new anchors and less people would get hurt or worse, die.
Remember this...when you TR or lower off a route's anchors, you are putting every other climber after you in danger. You are prematurly weakening the anchors at an exponential rate. PLEASE STOP DOING THIS!
If you hear someone, like me and my wife, say "off belay!", that's usually a good sign that they're doing it right and rapping off rather then lowering. I will lower off all day long ON MY OWN TR, but never on the anchors themselves.
Bottom Line: Bring your own top rope and NEVER lower off the anchors.
That being said, my sincere condollences to the family and friends of the climber that lost his life.
|
|
BringYourOwnTR!
climber
|
|
and........
Did you not get the point? It's entirely possible that someone just died because of this problem. The details of this accident need to be released that state weather this was gear failure or human error. If it was in fact caused by the anchors being worn down, then this should be a massive wake-up call to everyone that contributes to this growing problem.
|
|
Matt
Trad climber
places you shouldn't talk about in polite company
|
|
i agree entirely, about NOT TRing on fixed gear, this will be an even greater tragedy if the cause was not pilot error but failure of eroded fixed gear due to careless and lazy fellow climbers who are so frequently unwilling to bother to preserve anchors.
greg- i'm really suprised that you seem to support the automatic lowering of the leader from the open shunts, don't you have enough work?
as for HK's post, that's close but not quite right-
you should of course be clipped in direct to something if you are untying your knot to rethread, and if you expect to lower off, you should have the belayer take up all the slack and be "on" their belay, weighting it entirely before you unclip from whatever you are in direct with. (edit- and therefore "leaning back" will only take you onto whatever you are in direct with, and at ORG you are usually hanging from it /edit)
it's not rocket science, but it sure is unfortunate whenever it goes south for any reason, add my condolences as well.
|
|
hummingbyrd
climber
|
|
To Margritte (hope I spelled this correctly): Thank you so much for contacting the Inyo Register for us. I was on the website but the latest was Feb 1. I printed out thye article and will take it along with the obit in Waukesha Freeman (with photo) to church tonight to post on our bulletin board. I am not a climber, but my daughter is. Wow, there's been a lot of convo since I last posted about the accident. It's nice to know there are so many great people in the world. Again,thank you all for info and God Bless you and be safe on those climbs - this comes from a mom.
|
|
Greg Barnes
climber
|
|
I didn't want to stir up any controversy in this thread, especially since I've been at that anchor in the last few weeks and I know it's not worn down.
TRing through fixed gear is generally a bad idea, and should be strongly discouraged in most areas.
However, Owens has a tradition of open anchors to allow quick lower-off by leaders, often with the second then leading (or the leader cleaning draws and the second not even climbing that route). For people TRing a group, use your own gear of course.
Locals have always known that this tradition means a lot more work maintaining anchors - which is why the mussy hook system (with an inch thick metal at the lower-off and easy changing of hooks) is great.
But the convenience and added safety of not messing around at anchors is seen as worth the extra effort it takes to maintain the anchors.
I know people get all worked up about this at many areas - I do myself - but the Owens system is NOT the same as most areas.
And, as we've all seen in every climbing area, a good number of people will TR through whatever anchors are there regardless of anchor wear. Considering the gritty volcanic dust and low humidity (static electricity = super dusty ropes), if we used chains at Owens they would get very scary in no time. The inch-thick mussy hooks wear half way through in a few years, are easily replaced, and if they get too scary you can leave a biner. Way better than the old cold shut system...
Greg
PS Mussy hooks can be sketchy on slabby anchors since the back of the gates can scrape the rope. We've figured out a relatively easy way of fixing this problem and so next summer I'll be working on the anchors at Clark Canyon (the most worn anchors there are nearly all on slabby rock). I'll likely be using huge glue-in bolts so we can replace the loosening bolts in the same holes.
|
|
HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
Arid-zona
|
|
Another one dies to rappelling while sport climbing. How sad. Only 23! Much love to friends and family and thank you to the may people who I'm sure helped in the recovery.
|
|
BringYourOwnTR!
climber
|
|
People who can't simply put two draws in at the top and lower off those instead of "quick clipping" are just lazy. Usually, you clip a draw into the anchor anyway when you get to the top. Either lower off that one, with the others below it as backups, or simply clip another draw in the other anchor and lower off both. The person being lowered can clean the route if the next person wants it cleaned and you can pull the rope after being lowered so the next person can lead it if they want. If you are the only one climbing the route then just clean it on the way down, but still rappell the route. No one should be lowering off the anchors EVER...bad habits get passed on to new climbers down the road and as this sport continues to grow, the bigger this problem will be.
|
|
crusher
climber
Santa Monica, CA
|
|
Greg,
Does the donation box at Wilson's help you guys pay for the gear you need at Clark also?
|
|
Dire Wolf
Trad climber
San Francisco
|
|
um, yeah. sad. but always a good idea to rap or use your own gear for a top rope. it kinda figures it happend at the great wall of china, i usually call that place the rock gym due to the scene at it.
|
|
Gary
climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
|
|
This is so sad, my condolences to his friends and family.
We shouldn't get nonchalant with belay signals.
|
|
Greg Barnes
climber
|
|
crusher, Owens & Clark anchors are replaced with a combo of the Wilson's and MMS donation boxes, ASCA donations, and personal gear on the part of many locals. Tony Puppo at the Rubber Room did lots of replacement for years and helps out with getting the gear. Also Marty Lewis does a lot of replacement that he funds from his guidebook sales. Generally speaking, the donation jars cover most everything.
|
|
crusher
climber
Santa Monica, CA
|
|
Cool Greg, thanks. I'll be sure to donate next time I'm up there and encourage everyone else to do the same. Thanks to you all for the work.
And sincere condolences to the family and friends of Ian.
|
|
schilds
Trad climber
eastside
|
|
My heart goes out to the family and friends of Ian, and especially to his climbing partner. This was a terrible accident and I don't think that any of the posters know what happened exactly, though some good points have been raised. Neither do I, as I wasn't there that day. I was at work at the hospital though when they brought him in, and I wanted to send my thanks out to all of the people, climbers and non, involved in the rescue. Many people worked very hard to try to save his life, and I would hope that any of us would do the same if we were at the scene of such an accident. So thank you to all of the rescuers, and to the people who stuck around and took care of Ian's partner. I can only imagine her heartbreak and pain, and hope that she may eventually find some peace. To me at least, it is a comfort to know that the climbing community takes care of each other.
|
|
Ksolem
Trad climber
LA, Ca
|
|
All the speculation is just that. I think it would be good to know what happened, but either way we should just wait and see rather than trying to find fault. This could happen to any one of us. I caught my girlfriend by the hand once when her improperly tied knot came undone at a stance. Our lucky day, that was.
Schilds' comments open a small window on how deeply an accident like this can cut. I hope the best for his friend and partner.
|
|
Ksolem
Trad climber
LA, Ca
|
|
Whitey, didn't mean you in particular. Just there's been a lot of stuff said and suggested on this thread overall... by folks who don't have a clue what actually happenned.
Cheers,
Kris
|
|
Jerry Dodrill
climber
Bodega, CA
|
|
I don't pretend to have a clue what happened, just was wondering about the anchor because it crossed my mind while clipping one in the area, as I said up thread. I am an advocate of rapping/lowering on my own gear as well. However, hardly anyone does this at Owens because the place is so dialed for convenient lower-offs, as Greg detailed. I was just trying to figure out what might have occurred, and it's been made clear that something other than anchor failure was at fault.
I didn't realize the God of Anchor Preservation was passing judgement on off hand comments with a hair trigger today. (Was it worth the trouble to sign up for the forum just for that little flame fest? Whatever, Shawn...)
Peace to Ian's family and friends.
|
|
BringYourOwnTR!
climber
|
|
It was abolutely worth signing up to the forum to get this point accross to all climbers! ORG is a unique area with a vast climbing community in Bishop. Never have I seen such involvement in maintaining a climbing area anywhere else in the world. I am very thankful (and still alive because of it) that people maintain the area. However, we need to start passing the word that TR-ing and lowering off the anchors is a bad thing to do.
Consider this scenario. A person is taken out climbing for the first time to ORG with someone who is TR-ing and lowering off the anchors. That person gets hooked, liked we all did, and starts climbing seriously. That person is learning to climb without knowing that this is a problem and he/she thinks that's the right way to sport climb. Fast forward a couple months to where this person is really into climbing now. Now, this person wants to climb in some other areas and states. This person goes to any other area ouside of Bishop and takes these bad habbits with him/her. Now the problem has spread to other areas besides the Gorge. Fast forward a few years, this person has kids and gets them into climbing and teaches them the same bad habbits....I think you get the picture here.
For those of you who do not think this is as serious as I'm making it: you're nieve. We shouldn't have to wait until someone gets seriously hurt or killed for everyone to finally wake up on this issue. This is something that can EASILY be prevented, and can avoid completely unneccessary accidents. I'm not saying that was the case with this accident, but if climbers continue to do this, then it's only a matter of time.
If I can open at least one person's eyes to this issue, then yes: IT WAS WORTH SIGNING UP TO THIS FORUM.
|
|
10b4me
Trad climber
California
|
|
sorry to hear this. my condolences to his family, and friends.
|
|
Greg Barnes
climber
|
|
Bringyourown.., if you feel so strongly about this why don't you start another thread, and leave this thread to condolences and reports on this accident.
|
|
briand
Trad climber
bay area
|
|
Condolences to the family and friends. Thanks to all who keep the anchors safe. I always try to give money for that.
Yes people, always check your partners knot/harness.
Years ago, my partner and I were the first to show up to an accident at the Pub wall. This guy had decked from the top of one of the .11s in the middle(100+ feet). I couldn't believe the guy was still alive and he wasn't too injured relatively speaking. Csuse of accident was not finishing his knot. His rope was still clipped to all the bolts and anchors with his half finished knot stuck at the top. From what I last heard, he was doing ok after mult. surgeries and a lot of rehab.
(anyone know? I understand he was a local)
|
|
dede
climber
|
|
Hugs & prayers to the family and friends of Ian Mack - my heart aches for you.
Doris Dworkin (Jimmy Ray's mother)
|
|
Marty Lewis
climber
Bishop, CA
|
|
It will be very interesting to find out what caused this tragic accident.
It seems the integrity of the anchor had nothing to do with this accident.
Greg Barnes-great comments-especially about starting a new thread on anchors.
But I just can't help chiming in:
News flash-all anchors wear out. Remember adding slings or rap rings to anchors back in the day? Or seeing chains half worn and using your own carabiner? Wether you lower or rappel when you pull the rope through it puts wear on the anchor.
All anchors will wear out. If you see a questionable anchor sacrifice some carabiners or fix it yourself. If you can't do that then let some local activists know about the problem. Don't blame it on what previous climbers did. Climbing is always up to you assessing your own safety.
I've climbed at at least 15 major sport climbing areas in the US and 90% of the people lower off. Just use your own quickdraws (open or closed anchor) and there is no wear on the anchor. when the last person comes up they can thread the anchor and lower off or rappel. What's the big deal?
|
|
dmalloy
Trad climber
eastside
|
|
my partner and I have been waiting until we woke up this morning to check the weather and decide - sunny, climb at the Gorge? Snowing in Mammoth, go skiing? or raining everywhere, go to Keough's and soak? It now looks like another perfect Bishop day, just a few lenticulars floating around in a blue sky, so off the Gorge we will go.
I had to remind myself last night that climbing there is no less safe today than it was last Saturday - perhaps a bit of the joy is removed, but we'll love each day we have and remember those who have stayed in the mountains for good.
For those of us still fortunate to be here and climbing, I would like to do some chiming in and some repeating. Nothing earth-shattering here, but they might be new ideas for some people, reminders for others, or totally worth skipping for many.
Before I lived here I climbed around the East Coast for a few years, including a number of areas where anchors could not be threaded without untying from the rope. At first those anchors - frequently somewhat thin-looking chain links - freaked me out a little. But I developed some habits that provided an extra measure of safety, and I believe that if we are to think clearly about accidents we ought to pay attention to minimizing our own risk.
As the first leader to reach an anchor that required untying in order to thread, I would always leave draws or (usually) slings with locking biners as the anchor for any topropers. If I was the last person in our party to toprope or lead a climb, I would untie and thread the anchor, and then always rappel, not lower. Why rappel? Because it removed the potential hazard of miscommunication with my belayer, one of the factors in the safety chain that seems hard to control. Most folks I know would tie back in and lower, which puts additional wear on the anchor, and adds the dangerous potential for mixed signals into the situation. So one important lesson here is that if you are going to have to untie and thread, rappel, don't lower.
Second thing in that situation - when I was the belayer for a person who wished to lower rather than rappel, when they called "off belay" I would pull out about 10-15 ft of slack and leave them on belay. That allows enough room to thread anchors, retie knots, etc, while still providing a belay in case of miscommunication. So that seems like another good idea for those who find themselves threading anchors to keep in mind - you can provide oodles of slack, and still maintain a backup belay.
Nowadays I climb at the Gorge more than anywhere else, and throw some money in the Wilson's basket on occasion. We also try to pass along to the local activists some idea about where anchors or other bolts could use some help, and there is a big, experienced crew who do a wonderful job of taking care of those issues. I have often thought that there should be some sort of online resource for people to post needs and the activists to indicate when they have been addressed, but right now the grapevine seems to be quite effective without technological help.
Although Mussy hooks are a great solution for the Gorge, we still use our own slings and lockers for the initial leader to lower, or for any other people to toprope. An informal survey tells me that we are in the minority in that behavior amongst locals - most will lower from the Mussy hooks or other anchors even if another climber is planning to lead, and most will also toprope through those anchors even if multiple toprope efforts are planned. I have reached the point that I don't even encourage those people to use their own gear for toproping, since a few efforts at engaging the topic have never yielded anyone deciding to use their own gear.
That being said, we are blessed by the bombproof nature of the Mussy hooks and the attention of the local activists, which have created a situation at the Gorge that is much safer than the situation at areas where anchors must be threaded.
It is true that beginners should not be taught to transport the habits and behaviors of the Gorge to other areas, but I think that speaks more to the fact that life is most safe when we continue to always think critically about our situation, rather than allowing habits to guide our actions. Beginners should be encouraged to carefully examine the fixed gear they might use and everything else that can create a safe situation, and to make decisions based on what they think. So many people, particulary those who might have been introduced to climbing at gyms or through bouldering, want to just "GO FOR IT" - the folks who have been fortunate to enjoy climbing with accidents for many years should work to create an atmosphere of patient learning and critical thinking, even when we are out pushing our limits and whipping onto fat bolts.
I hope that was not too long or pedantic, and that it addresses the ways we can all limit our potential for accidents across a wide variety of areas. Everyone get out there and have fun, smile a little bigger at the climber next to you, find a friendly way to make suggestions to those who might look like they need them - and most of all, remember that Ian is out someplace climbing on sticky, solid stone, with miles of exposure, surrounded by friends, with no need for bolts or ropes.
|
|
looking sketchy there...
Social climber
Latitute 33
|
|
To Ian's friends and family, my wife and I extend our deepest condolences.
|
|
Shelton Gregory
climber
Tahoe City
|
|
To the Mack family - I can't imagine the sorrow and pain you are going through. My heart aches for your tragic loss.
We were climbing on the Pub wall, directly across from the Bananna Belt, at the time of the accident. My partner was finishing cleaning a route when I witnessed the fall. We grabbed the litter that hangs from the bathroom at the middle gorge, and met others who were already providing care to Ian. We carried Ian to the power plant (lower gorge) having instructed the person who ran to the rim to call 911 to have them meet us there. We were met by the ambulance and despite of the efforts of everyone involved we later learned he did not survive.
Another person in our party climbed the route (Love Stink's - I think) and discovered a top rope anchor properly set up (lockers on a cordalette to the hangers, to not put undue wear on the lower off hooks). The rope was tied to Ian when the first people arrived on the scene. The rope ran from Ian through the anchors, through all of the draws, and both ends were down. The party closest to him clearly heard him say "Off Belay", and Ian's partner did just that.
Communicate with your parter. Discuss what you are going to do before you leave the ground. Don't assume anything.
|
|
WBraun
climber
|
|
Whoa, so now we know the full details.
Thanks Shelton
|
|
SoSAD
climber
Appleton, WI
|
|
Shelton can you translate into non-climber english exactly what you found out. In simple terms, if I can read between the lines, that all the equipment was in tact and connected properly, except for the connection to Ian. His "off belay" was his instruction that he was ready?
I know absolutely zero about climbing but have been trying to find out any information I can for my friend - Ian's father should he desire to know details.
|
|
BringYourOwnTR!
climber
|
|
Wow, that is very unfortunate. Thank you for posting all the details.
I did have a question though. You said that the party next to them heard him say "off belay". If that's true, then did his belayer not say "you're off" in response? I would think that if Ian heard this, that he would respond to his belayer "no, no, that's not what I meant". Also, are we sure that he in fact said "off belay" and not another climber next to him? I know how close and crowded that area can be and it can get confusing on communicating to your partner with a lot of other climbers right next to you.
Regardless, a very unfortunate accident.
|
|
Fluoride
Trad climber
California somewhere
|
|
Thanks for sharing Shelton. That clears things up a lot.
Condolences to his friends and family coming here.
|
|
schilds
Trad climber
eastside
|
|
To SoSAD: Please check your email re: climbing to english translation.
|
|
Ksolem
Trad climber
LA, Ca
|
|
That is a touching and beautiful memorial. I am sorry you lost your friend. A reminder how precious our time here is, and how much it means to live well and fully.
|
|
L
climber
The City of Lost Angels
|
|
Adam--Really beautiful and touching memorial to Ian. I'm sincerely sorry for your loss.
|
|
Hardman Knott
Gym climber
Muir Woods National Monument, Mill Valley, Ca
|
|
Indeed, that was a very nicely done memorial.
This is truly heartbreaking - so young, and with so much ahead of him.
Definitely a reminder to make the most of each and every day.
RIP, bro.
|
|
happiegrrrl
Trad climber
New York, NY
|
|
Busy the last few days, I didn't look at this thread til just now. Clearly, Ian was a guy well-loved by many people and will be missed deeply. My heartfelt prayers go out to you all. I grew up in Wisconsin, with a sister still in DePere. Even though I probably don't know any of you, I still feel a loss.
|
|
Anastasia
Trad climber
Mammoth Lakes, CA
|
|
My deepest condolences for Ian's family and friends.
I must remind everyone in this forum that we have all done mistakes while climbing. We should all be wary in this sport. I for one always check John's handiwork even though he is the "Great John Bachar."
In fact wasn't it Lynn Hill that didn't finnish her figure 8 and almost lost her life?
This goes to show that Ian's mistake could happen to anyone...
AF
|
|
don'thaveone
climber
bishop
|
|
Thanks for sharing for the video. I hope that you, his family, and the people with him during the accident may find peace.
|
|
Mick Ryan
Trad climber
Kendal, English Lake District
|
|
Greg...fire me your telephone number.... Mick
mick@ukclimbing.com
Condolances.....very sad.
Mick in the UK
|
|
fallenclimber
Trad climber
Davis, California
|
|
|
Feb 10, 2007 - 02:34pm PT
|
Adam: Thanks for your time and effort in producing a wonderful, touching, moving and well-done memorial and tribute to an individual who was clearly living his life well.
From one who once, after a fall, for reasons that need not be mentioned, hung suspended, along with his buddy, from a single, upside down piton, staring down 2000 feet to the Yosemite Vally floor and out to the near horizon of his mortality:
To Ian: an offering of respect and remembrance to a fellow traveler who chose climbing as one of his means to seek adventure, to explore his life, and to share camaraderie with others of like mind. Peace be with you. May you be long remembered.
|
|
Russ S.
climber
|
|
|
Feb 10, 2007 - 04:22pm PT
|
My condolences to Ian's family and friends..
Since no one else has comment on: "I did have a question though. You said that the party next to them heard him say "off belay". If that's true, then did his belayer not say "you're off" in response? I would think that if Ian heard this, that he would respond to his belayer "no, no, that's not what I meant".
When my partner says "off belay", I don't respond with "you're off" (or "belays off") until he/she is free from my belay and can pull up the rope as needed. However, I do look up to see that they are resting on the anchors. This has been my practice for many years and consistant with how I see most people doing it. The exception is, if the person wants to be lowered, then I don't really take them off, just feed out slack so they can feed the rope through the anchor.
What do others do?
|
|
AdamWundrow
Boulder climber
WIsconsin
|
|
|
Feb 10, 2007 - 07:09pm PT
|
I wish this forum on Ian Mack would never end. I know we must move on and I can do that by using his life as my inspiration and passion to be incredible. I am ready to momorialize Ian in my own life by living that life to the absolute fullest that only he would approve.
I am sincerely mournful and as is his family and friends here in Wisconsin. His wake had a line to the door for 6 hours straight. In the years that he lived - he affected, influenced, inspired everyone he met. I will live on and do what he would do. Being a best friend - I think I know his thoughts. If anyone has any ideas or thoughts or contacts that would help me live a memorial to him - please send me your love.
One more thing - before he died he told me to watch "Monumental" a documentary on David Brower. He said that I wuold really like it, and I fell in love with the movie of course. and as a soul who loved music he provided me with all the beautiful tunes that were being created past and present. I told him that I wanted the soundtrack to Monumental. And he responded "so do I" - We didn't get that soundtrack and I have been told that it may not exist. If anyone has the music please send it my way - to awundrow@gmail.com or 2620 N. weil st. #4, Milwaukee, WI 53212.
The video I posted is the first of many more- peace and love.
|
|
Chateau Rico
Trad climber
Davis, CA
|
|
|
Feb 10, 2007 - 07:41pm PT
|
Response to Russ, et al: My condolescences also. Wow is climbing fraught with these sad stories.
ORG experts Marty and Greg chimed in, but having climbed there dozens of times and a few go's on Love Stinks, I can imagine the challenges of communicating on that route. Clearly the accident resulted from a communication error, and on that route, the leader finishes quite high and just over a bulge. The belayer, either on the ledge or on the ground, is standing fairly close to the noisy Owens River. So, although it's been a couple years ago, I'd imagine that normal voice communication didn't work for either party. Normally that results in more careful assumptions regarding the belay/ lower, but a lot of the discussion in this thread about good practice or standard practice probably doesn't address what happened that day. My guess is they didn't hear each other, then both made the wrong assumption.
|
|
Beth Thomas and Joe Dengler
climber
Terrebonne, Oregon
|
|
|
Feb 12, 2007 - 04:58pm PT
|
We left for a week following the accident; we just realized today there was a online forum. In addition to Shelton's posting, here is what we also witnessed.
We had been at an area just downstream and were walking up to the Banana Belt to meet with friends, arriving within minutes after the accident. A local climber ran to the top of the Gorge to call. As we came up, another climber was asking for a cell phone, we advised them of the 911 phone on the fence at the Middle Gorge Power Plant, 100 yards away. Please read page 44 of the current guide book. Per Bob Mitchell (of DWP who was very fast on the scene and unlocked the gate at the top of the Middle Gorge Road) the chain-of-command is set up thru the phone and must be used so that the gate can be opened. DWP answers this emergency phone first and they are there 24 hour/7 days a week /365 days a year. DWP is on the scene first to unlock the gate - the ambulance does not have a key; although the fire truck does. Per Bob, there is also a 911 phone at the dam, upstream of the upper gorge.
The route that Ian had climbed was Paradise, a 5.9 which is a few routes right of Love Stinks. Piecing together what everyone overheard, what the gear retriever discovered, and what the system looked like after - it sadly, really must have been due to his human error; not the belayer, and not a gorge anchor. He asked to be taken Off Belay. It appears he later sat back in the rope, forgetting he had asked to be taken off.
The dozen or so climbers there were so helpful to care for Ian. It never seems as though the Gorge is a remote place. The response time from the 911 calls to the arrival of EMS was approxiamtely 40-45 minutes, in our guess. Our hearts go out to the family and friends.
|
|
Jaybro
Social climber
The West
|
|
|
Feb 12, 2007 - 08:24pm PT
|
Very nice video tribute, Adam. I have memory associations with many of those places in Utah and I learned to climb at Devil's Lake, not to mention a bunch of climbing @ the gorge, all of which brings me closer to ian, who I can now in an increasing way identify with, though I don't think I ever met him.
Thanks and again, condolences and best wishes to all involved.
|
|
mtsun
Trad climber
Bishop, Ca
|
|
|
Feb 12, 2007 - 11:46pm PT
|
I am glad to see that several people have clarified what happened. I too was at the Pub wall and helped with Ians evac.
My heart filled condolescences to his friends, family, and especially his climbing partner, who in no way was responsible for what happened.
Adam- Thank you for the beautiful tribute to our Ian. Rumor has it that he was moving to the Bishop area. We would have loved to have him as a part of our community and our saddened by his premature departure. Continue to explore and relish in nature as he would have wanted you to. You are in our thoughts.
|
|
Mia
climber
Moab,
|
|
|
Feb 13, 2007 - 02:01am PT
|
Adam
It's been a sad week in Moab. We lost a very special friend. Ian touched our hearts with his smile and exceptional personality. He was one of the kindest young men I have ever met. He tutored my daughter in math and always encouraged her to do her best. He gave new meaning to the word passion. I am also close to Erika, and know that she has lost her best friend as well. The two were such a sweet couple. I just knew they would be together forever. Please give condolences to Ian's family from his friends in Moab-He had many! By the way your video was very nice, I know Ian would have loved it as much as he loved you. Peace be with you.
Mia
|
|
AdamWundrow
Boulder climber
WIsconsin
|
|
|
Feb 13, 2007 - 03:25pm PT
|
If anyone is familiar with "Facebook" on the web - please know that there is an online tribute/memorial/discussion board with many photos. It allows you to post stories or upload photos and find out more about Ian.
I hope that anyone who has more to share will look into it. The name of the group is called "Ian Mack in Peace"
And to all us climbers and hikers please recognize the fragileness of life, but don't hesitate to live it to the fullest as Ian did. I wish you all the very best.
Peace
|
|
Shelley Mack
climber
Appleton, WI
|
|
|
Feb 15, 2007 - 10:47am PT
|
Dear Friends,
I write this with heavy heart as a parent of a child that I will forever miss but will one day see again. I wanted to extend my love and thankfulness to all the amazing people who helped Ian on that day…Bruce, Beth, Joe, Aiden, Rose, and especially dear Erika. At some point we will talk, but for right now, I gather strength in my faith.
I understand and appreciate your forum on Ian’s death, but what happened at the top of that rock on February 4 was between Ian and God. Yes, our lives are fragile and we all make mistakes, but they are not our own as God tells us that from the time we are born into this sin-filled world, it’s not a matter of “if” but “when” we will someday die. He chose Ian at that time for reasons unknown and I harbor no blame, but cling to Ian’s faith in a Savior who has given him eternal life. As stated above, Ian is now climbing on sticky, solid stone, with miles of exposure, surrounded by friends, with no need for bolts or ropes…a place called heaven.
Ian was a wonderful son, brother, friend and touched more people than we will ever know. I am overwhelmed by the outpouring of love from all around the world. His grandmother referred to him as her “golden” child as he greeted every day with an amazing smile, warm heart, and a zest for adventure, and he was going to take every opportunity God gave him. He was, in fact, to begin a job in Bishop that particular week and had just arrived the night before. I am not a climber, but Ian’s love for the sport was as apparent as all of yours, and I’m sure you would have seen him often and had the opportunity to meet or even climb with him. The exhilaration when he reached the top of a rock or mountain was something even Ian could barely describe, but I’m sure all of you know.
So, climb onward for Ian, check your ropes, anchors, communicate with one another, but do so with love for your fellow climbers and in a faith secure so that when God calls, you too will be climbing with Ian, farther than you can imagine.
Cheers and love from Ian and his family
|
|
madamelapin
climber
|
|
|
Mar 23, 2007 - 02:44am PT
|
We just planted a small hardy plant with delicate and pretty yellow flowers for Ian at the base of the Paradise route (located in the Banana Belt across from the Pub Wall). We encircled the plant with rocks. We also placed baby pink and white roses called 'angel flash roses' around the plant. We smiled after counting over 100 small roses. The plant is located about 15 feet from the river. We'd like to ask fellow climbers to help water the plant so that it may grow. We wanted to honor Ian and our relationship with him.
-- Friends in California
|
|
phylp
Trad climber
Upland, CA
|
|
I saw for the first time today that all the trees on that side of the river were removed. Pretty barren looking over there now.
There was a beautiful little memorial for Ian hung in a tree near the base. I don't suppose anyone rescued it before the trees went down?
|
|
| Messages 1 - 87 of total 87 in this topic |
|
SuperTopo on the Web
|
Let us know!