Discussion Topic |
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karodrinker
Trad climber
San Jose, CA
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Topic Author's Original Post - Nov 25, 2010 - 02:10pm PT
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I'm one, so is just about everyone I see out on the rocks. What up with that? Why so few minorities pullin down? Sure, there's some Asians around, and my favorite partner is half Mexican, but I think that 90% of climbers I meet are dorky white guys.
Oh yeah, happy thanksgiving.
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Josh Nash
Social climber
riverbank ca
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Nov 25, 2010 - 02:24pm PT
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ultimately I got into climbing by reading books and/or national geographic about the sport growing up. I think most people who get into climbing it's the same way. Also climbing is way technical and gear intense.Dorky white people like their gadgets. It's also outdoors and really mostly dorky white people enjoy the outdoors. Look at who you meet in the back country.
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utahman912
Social climber
SLC, UT
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Nov 25, 2010 - 02:32pm PT
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i figured it to be nerds, not dorks
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Nov 25, 2010 - 02:35pm PT
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Why are most suicide bombers muslims?
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Prod
Trad climber
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Nov 25, 2010 - 02:36pm PT
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Remember when we used to wear tights? Oh man that was.....
AWESOME!!!!
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ron gomez
Trad climber
fallbrook,ca
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Nov 25, 2010 - 02:38pm PT
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Well I must be a dorky Mexican, Indian, Filipino! What the hell, I like climbing and that's why I do it. Oh yeah I also like all my dorky white guy climbin friends. Dorky!
Peace
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Peter Haan
Trad climber
San Francisco, CA
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Nov 25, 2010 - 02:39pm PT
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Adam Ondra, Rajfova and Martin Stranik at the 2008 Czech finals: a study in different forms of hotness
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Ghost
climber
A long way from where I started
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Nov 25, 2010 - 02:52pm PT
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Dorky? Moi?
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Crimpergirl
Sport climber
Boulder, Colorado!
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Nov 25, 2010 - 02:52pm PT
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I think you mean hot, not dorky!
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Nov 25, 2010 - 03:07pm PT
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It is cultural.
Most other people have more common sense.
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Mungeclimber
Trad climber
sorry, just posting out loud.
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Nov 25, 2010 - 03:24pm PT
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So at PG Sunnyvale you think the majority of climbers in there are white guys?
so I see a boat load of females, and of the male population, on any given night I see a pretty diverse bunch. Filipinos, Mexicans, Asians, and more and more of the India sub continent and their descendants.
I just don't see white males being the dominant population in there.
Out at the crags, maybe that's another story...
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Prezwoodz
climber
Anchorage
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Nov 25, 2010 - 03:25pm PT
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I do often feel like a bit of a minority while I'm climbing. Ive asked some of my other friends who are black why they don't climb. Basically its because there not stupid and I am...
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Steve L
Gym climber
SUR
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Nov 25, 2010 - 03:37pm PT
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Economic and cultural reasons. Things are changing, but most minorities are poor and live in urban areas. Climbing gear costs money and so does driving to the crag. I cant speak for other races, but most latinos think the whole 'outdoor lifestyle' thing is crazy. Even sleeping outside when you don't have to is strange, let alone sleeping on a ledge. Obviously, this is slowly changing as more generations grow up here and economic conditions improve, but the attitude is still very prevalent. Also, most latinos are very family oriented. Leaving for an entire day or for multiple days without the entire family just doesn't happen. Most of my cousins will go play soccer on a saturday morning and then come back and spend the weekend doing stuff with their own families and with the broader extended family. I'm the family odd ball because I disappear for days at time, without any other family members, drive long distances to sleep in the dirt, and climb sh#t.
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'Pass the Pitons' Pete
Big Wall climber
like Ontario, Canada, eh?
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Nov 25, 2010 - 03:37pm PT
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Never underestimate a dorky white guy. Lurking under that geeky shirt tucked into pants pulled up to his chest, you may well find Balls Of Steel.
[Bless you, Crimpie]
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harihari
Trad climber
Squampton
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Nov 25, 2010 - 03:51pm PT
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It seems t me that (most) black people are in a similar postion to Latinos-- recent cultural experiences of poverty for many mean that deprivation is not the road to fun. Here in Canada, Indo-Canadians feel the same way-- why would anybody in their right mind sleep in the dirt, freeze, and suffer, for "fun"? That's what the poor are forced to do in India.
It is also important to note that the cultural background of climbing is a Brit (and German, and Swiss) upper-class, social-status-demonstrating tradition. The Romantic poets 200 years ago were rich kids who had grown up in enough luxury to have time/energy to enjoy the outdoors. E.g. Wordsworth got an inheritance, so he could enjoy spending evenings walking around the Lake District crags, composing poems, while the peasants were forced to walk to carry their loads of potatos or whatever to market. The Brits have long romanticised the lone white hero, striding off into the wilderness to "conquer" something. (It is interesting in climbing that climbers get to name their routes-- how much does this sound like what exporers used to do? Can you imagine a runner naming his best 200m run?)
The poor stick around their village; the rich imaginative white guy blazes off into the unknown.
There's loads of climbers who carry a subtle class arrogance about them-- "we" are beyond proletarian crap like football, NASCAR, beer bellies and video games, and into "cool" stuff that sorts the athletic wheat from the chaff-- "we" climb.
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Ricky D
Trad climber
Sierra Westside
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Nov 25, 2010 - 03:54pm PT
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"football, NASCAR, beer bellies and video games"
Haven't been to a Facelift have you?
Okay - maybe just the beer belly part.
;)
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Dr.Sprock
Boulder climber
I'm James Brown, Bi-atch!
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Nov 25, 2010 - 03:58pm PT
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dorky white guy?
my middle name,
i have no defense,
kayakers?
same deal,
all dorky white rich people, suv full of gas and ready to go.
when they come back, the big house is already to comfort them for the easy money work week,
the only climbing the mexicans wanna do is over the lectric fence,
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G_Gnome
Trad climber
In the mountains... somewhere...
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Nov 25, 2010 - 03:59pm PT
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That's generally not Class arrogance, it is usually more an arrogance born of experience and them knowing that in general they actually are better then most others. Can't argue with reality. Myself, I prefer to call it Cocky instead.
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Paco
Trad climber
Montana
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Nov 25, 2010 - 04:05pm PT
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because every non-white, non-dorky athlete is doing something that involves a lot more comfort...and a LOT more money.
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marv
Mountain climber
Bay Area
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Nov 25, 2010 - 04:09pm PT
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exact same answer as "Why are most male college graduates dorky white guys"
seriously.
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Nov 25, 2010 - 05:09pm PT
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t*r
"entitled attitude" discussed where?
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Peter Haan
Trad climber
San Francisco, CA
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Nov 25, 2010 - 05:11pm PT
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Prezwoodz, I didn't know. When exactly did you become black?
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Rhodo-Router
Gym climber
wussing off the topout on Roadside Attraction
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Nov 25, 2010 - 05:24pm PT
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The entitlement discussion is pretty much as harihari said, Ron, do we have to paint you a picture?
I'm one of them and I think hh nailed it. It's the Bwana Syndrome.
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Ricky D
Trad climber
Sierra Westside
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Nov 25, 2010 - 05:28pm PT
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Too small for football.
Too short for basketball.
Nobody played soccer in 1978.
Don't like sharks and can't swim for sh#t - so no surfing.
Really did well at wrestling - but people think it's ghey.
Climbing seemed the only thing left at the time.
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Ricky D
Trad climber
Sierra Westside
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Nov 25, 2010 - 05:38pm PT
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What the real question should be is...
"Why did so many climbers end up being engineers?".
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Nov 25, 2010 - 05:58pm PT
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what steve says - a lot of it has to do with who historically has had access to what privileges.
t*r, you are the perfect of example of what you claim to be against. An arrogant whitey.
That is NOT what Steve's point was. You look at everything through a lens of 'downtrodden', 'minority', or 'underprivaledged'.
Bullshit!
Many "minorities" have equal access to the sport. Most choose not to engage in it for the same reason other 'whities' don't. "I'm afraid of heights" or "that looks dangerous" or "why would you want to do that".
STFU!!!
Skippy eloquatly posited that;
Thinking inside the box can be an easy way to life. After all, you can trust that others have thought things through for you. But, when you step out and start to think for yourself, even the least among us can achieve great things.
Each and every one of us have within ourselves a brand new box to share with the world.
And knubskull replied;
^^^ an excellent example of the entitled attitude we've discussed
You really piss me off sometimes....
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Nov 25, 2010 - 06:03pm PT
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what steve says - a lot of it has to do with who historically has had access to what privileges.
t*r, you are the perfect of example of what you claim to be against. An arrogant whitey.
That is NOT what Steve's point was. You look at everything through a lens of 'downtrodden', 'minority', or 'underprivaledged'.
Bullshit!
Many "minorities" have equal access to the sport. Most choose not to engage in it for the same reason other 'whities' don't. "I'm afraid of heights" or "that looks dangerous" or "why would you want to do that".
STFU!!!
Skippy eloquatly posited that;
Thinking inside the box can be an easy way to life. After all, you can trust that others have thought things through for you. But, when you step out and start to think for yourself, even the least among us can achieve great things.
Each and every one of us have within ourselves a brand new box to share with the world.
And knubskull replied;
^^^ an excellent example of the entitled attitude we've discussed
You really piss me off sometimes....
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Ricky D
Trad climber
Sierra Westside
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Nov 25, 2010 - 06:05pm PT
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^^^^^
Blue...???
Where you been man?
Or more to the point...what therapy did you undergo while you were gone???
'Cause that last post was so humane and eloquent I can't help but feel that your inner liberal has at last been freed.
Of course, it could just be the after affects of Tryptophan.
Happy Thanksgiving dude!
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The Guy
Trad climber
Portland, OR
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Nov 25, 2010 - 06:05pm PT
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%100 Mexican climber here. I live in Portland, OR and have only seen one other border brother pulling down. Donde estas amigo?!!!
Anyways, yes climbers are mostly white or asian. At least what I have seen. All climbers are dorks. Don't deny it. Ask someone.
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Ricky D
Trad climber
Sierra Westside
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Nov 25, 2010 - 06:07pm PT
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I've been to Portland - where the hell do you find a decent taqueria in that white bread town?
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Ricky D
Trad climber
Sierra Westside
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Nov 25, 2010 - 06:16pm PT
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"i grew up in poverty."
Is that anywhere near South Lake Tahoe?
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Nov 25, 2010 - 06:20pm PT
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Have a good one too, Ricky. Tell Dawn I said "hey" and give Bear a pat on the head for me. Cheers!
i'm not white! and i'm not from the entitled social class we've been discussing. not at all. i grew up in poverty.
You're a fool and yet you think you're so smart by appearing compassionate. I'm not saying you're stupid, just foolish and naive. They've reeled you in and you don't even know it.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Nov 25, 2010 - 06:35pm PT
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And if you're not white and "privaleged", then what are you exactly? You appear to be so.
I'm not saying I am privaleged, although I'm a proud whitey of Italian/Dutch descent. But I fail to see how ethnicity has anything to do with climbing. It takes little money (despite eveyone bitching how expensive it is) to climb. It just takes a will to do it.
Many don't have the desire or the will. Nothing wrong with that. It's a funky pursuit that many call crazy.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Nov 25, 2010 - 07:01pm PT
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Yeah, so? Do you have a relevant comment on this idiotic topic?
And the more I think about it, I tend to suffer fools less when I'm not inbibing ze golden nectar.
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Nov 25, 2010 - 07:07pm PT
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Because white dorks see climbing as a viable alternative to growing up while most other (dorks) have better sense.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Nov 25, 2010 - 07:12pm PT
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Interesting point, Ron. Probably even a degree of truth in it. Just look at the array of "pro" climbers.
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GDavis
Social climber
SOL CAL
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Nov 25, 2010 - 07:26pm PT
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t*r is black?
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Nov 25, 2010 - 07:39pm PT
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Y'all are wrong. She's african/latina/persio-arabian/kulak...
She has suffered all at the hand of the useless whitey! White Persecution!!!!
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murcy
climber
sanfrancisco
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Nov 25, 2010 - 08:43pm PT
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Just speaking for myself, I really couldn't pull off being a suave Polynesian woman.
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dogtown
Trad climber
JackAssVille, Wyoming
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Nov 25, 2010 - 09:53pm PT
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AHH, don't know. Are they? Are all good climber white?
I know the best golfer is black kind-a.
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72hw
Trad climber
Pasadena, CA
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Nov 25, 2010 - 10:12pm PT
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Fat honky dork here - but my girlfriend/rope gun is Vietnamese, one of my favorite partners is an Indian Sikh, the guy who taught me to climb is Mexican, another frequent partner is too, my young protegee is an amazingly fearless Filipina, The Chief is part Native American and this crazy talented kid we hang around with to feel bad about ourselves is named Navarro if that counts for anything.
Now of course I have cherry picked my frequent circle of belay slaves and rope guns... the rest of us fall on the paler side of white indeed!
I still want to climb with my Brother from a Blacker Mother, but he too claims he is far too sane to do what us white boys call 'fun'!
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Nov 25, 2010 - 10:21pm PT
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Fat honky dork here - but my girlfriend/rope gun is Vietnamese, one of my favorite partners is an Indian Sikh, the guy who taught me to climb is Mexican, another frequent partner is too, my young protegee is an amazingly fearless Filipina, The Chief is part Native American and this crazy talented kid we hang around with to feel bad about ourselves is named Navarro if that counts for anything.
Now of course I have cherry picked my frequent circle of belay slaves and rope guns... the rest of us fall on the paler side of white indeed!
I still want to climb with my Brother from a Blacker Mother, but he too claims he is far too sane to do what us white boys call 'fun'!
Sounds like my crew. They just don't idetify themselves by ethnicity, prolly like your crew.
Just climb, leave race for how fast you do it!
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72hw
Trad climber
Pasadena, CA
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Nov 25, 2010 - 10:24pm PT
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Well said Bluering!
Indeed we don't see ourselves as different from one another - we're just climbers. Unless of course we are flailing like mental patients on some 5.4d test piece....
Then all bets are off!
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nature
climber
Tuscon Again! India! India! Hawaii! LA?!?!
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Nov 25, 2010 - 10:49pm PT
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you callin' me crackah?
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The Guy
Trad climber
Portland, OR
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Nov 25, 2010 - 11:07pm PT
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Ricky D- No good taqueria in this white bread town. Gotta go to the east side where all the border brother vatos hang out.
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Dr.Sprock
Boulder climber
I'm James Brown, Bi-atch!
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Nov 25, 2010 - 11:24pm PT
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climbing is kind of like the banjo,
thats all i have at the moment, but if you hang, i might finish that deeeep thought,
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Nov 26, 2010 - 01:42am PT
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Why are most climbers dorky white guys?
Uh, 'cause only a dorky white kid would think gettin' high like this is fun...
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Nov 26, 2010 - 02:27am PT
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Jim nailed it, just don't wind up in jail.....
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Dr.Sprock
Boulder climber
I'm James Brown, Bi-atch!
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Nov 26, 2010 - 05:07am PT
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i'm part black,
the best part,
get up on this bi-otch!
sometimes i use the ol schlongzie as a belaying device, just to chill out the ladies, feelin me, mo?
hey, has anybody ever takin a leak while belaying and have the wang dong doodle get all tangled up and turn blue?
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hobo_dan
Social climber
Minnesota
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Nov 26, 2010 - 09:34am PT
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A good and honest question--most of the people I've climbed with were not quite "right" and in the very small world of the climber they would go out and do fabulously brave and foolish things and I thought it was all fantastic.
These were people who questioned the value of:
a job
a spouse
a rope
a car
food
money
but never friendship or adventure
most were smaller and few really could get it right in society-I think of the story of Chuck Pratt and his disastrous date where he ends up at the ocean punching waves
I remember being at a party and everyone was on their way to getting engaged and married and mortgaged and children and I couldn't see it. I wanted to be out at some campsite or on some crack and pulling down and away from the whole machine.
most were talkers who wanted to challenge and think about IT
most saw how pointless the whole climbing thing was and were able to laugh at themselves
and after a summer in the dirt I would be ready or at least able to get through another 9 months of soap and obedience
And a million years later I can call these people any time day or night and we can talk about those castles in the sand
murf
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intothevoid
Mountain climber
Brooklyn
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Nov 26, 2010 - 10:05am PT
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Im going to point out the obvious here since it hasnt been but, how many minorities live in the areas where climbing is so prevalent?
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Tony Bird
climber
Northridge, CA
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Nov 26, 2010 - 10:55am PT
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back when i was trying to write for the slicks, i got an assignment from climbing magazine to profile black climbers. i came up with three, two of whom i knew personally from the sierra club rcs, the other a fellow out east who became a bit of a celebrity in african-american circles for the calendar shot of him hanging on one arm off a gunks overhang.
we did a number of interviews and it just didn't get focused enough to make a decent article, so i gave up on it. one of my friends, who grew up in l.a., said his mother used to take him and his siblings to the national parks every year. she figured it was their rights and heritage like anyone else's and he grew up with the joys of the grand canyon, yosemite, yellowstone. the other fellow was one heck of a tennis player before he got into climbing. somehow it seems those skills transfer--i know another climber like that.
i remember one of my interviewees just making the observation, with some resignation, "blacks are urban". that's changed, and i see lots of rainbow colors on the rock. if you live in california and can't see all the asians passing you on hard routes, you're probably just blanking out. maybe you wish climbing was only for white dorks.
and please, that word, white. take anthro 101.
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EdBannister
Mountain climber
13,000 feet
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Nov 26, 2010 - 12:37pm PT
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climber demographics.... whoa..
risk takers
almost no accountants
lawyers, docs, creative engineers (is that an oxymoron?) I mean people like Kris Solem, or Tom Frost, high technical skill but not tied up in structure or formulae.
People who are really great at what they do and still willing to not have complete control, and are in dire need of real and committed distraction. Rob Slater was a great example, 6 months on the trading floor, 6 months climbing. or Mari, research Biologist. perfect.
and let us not forget the other contingent, the how do i say it, surf bum stoner contingent.
neither group omes from the Crenshaw district,
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Nov 26, 2010 - 12:57pm PT
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Good. I'm glad she rubs your drunken ass the wrong way.
No wonder your neighbor hates you.
DMT
Hey Asshat, I solved that problem, remember? Or maybe you choose to recall only selected parts that fit you. And yeah, beer was involved in the solution.
Dick.
Or wait, your name is Dingus. Sorry.
And t*r's feel good crap is tired and useless.
i had a really wonderful thanksgiving day, i'm so sorry to peep in and see that some of you spent it in negativity. hope the last hours of this day can be saved for those of you who have been feeling so down that you try to bring others into your rut.
Pfftt! Are you f*#king serious with this crap!
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Nov 26, 2010 - 01:02pm PT
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Good. I'm glad she rubs your drunken ass the wrong way.
No wonder your neighbor hates you.
DMT
Hey Asshat, I solved that problem, remember? Or maybe you choose to recall only selected parts that fit you. And yeah, beer was involved in the solution.
Dick.
Or wait, your name is Dingus. Sorry.
And t*r's feel good crap is tired and useless.
i had a really wonderful thanksgiving day, i'm so sorry to peep in and see that some of you spent it in negativity. hope the last hours of this day can be saved for those of you who have been feeling so down that you try to bring others into your rut.
Pfftt! Are you f*#king serious with this crap!
EDIT: Repost because Locker bumped me off the page.
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Banquo
Trad climber
Morgan Hill, CA (Mo' Hill)
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Nov 26, 2010 - 01:26pm PT
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Dr.Sprock
Boulder climber
I'm James Brown, Bi-atch!
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Nov 26, 2010 - 01:54pm PT
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can i jump back in here for a minute or two?
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Nov 26, 2010 - 02:31pm PT
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Look at dem dinosaur eggs!
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Captain...or Skully
Big Wall climber
leading the away team, but not in a red shirt!
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Nov 26, 2010 - 06:00pm PT
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That thing looks grevious, Joe. TFPU.
As for Dorky white guys, that's just a rumor.
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nutjob
Trad climber
Berkeley, CA
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Nov 26, 2010 - 06:37pm PT
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I'll bet a lot of people who grow up with a natural inclination to climb trees (or buildings if there aren't many trees around) don't make the transition to rock climbing with technical gear. I climbed all kinds of buildings and trees and lamp posts growing up, but it wasn't until I went to college and met a few people who had climbing gear that I became aware of that as a real recreation option. I was vaguely aware of people who climbed in the Himalayas, but I was just ignorant of climbing beyond that. Even with this minimal exposure in college, it was just enough to get my foot in the door and buy Freedom of Hills (which was a random lucky purchase in a bargain bin somewhere) and figure out all the details on my own, acting as a mentor for whatever friends I could suck out to adventures when they thought I knew a little more than them. Suckas!
So education and leisure class definitely have something to do with it, for the basic exposure to the possibility. It's not like there is regular TV coverage or other mass media coverage for folks to find out about it unless they know someone who does it.
Maybe there's also a cultural thing related to the heritage of white people in America. Warning: sweeping generalization about to be delivered.... We're descended from people who valued their freedom and independence (or at least their lives) or sought their fortunes enough to leave their extended families in Europe and strike out on their own. We have nuclear families with minimal contact to distant relatives, we move around for work or schooling to further destabilize our family connections, and in general are just more OK to head off on our own to do stuff. So bailing on the family for a climbing trip is not as big of a deal for whities as it would be in cultures where folks make sacrifices to stick together and enjoy each other's company.
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Jello
Social climber
No Ut
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Nov 26, 2010 - 07:27pm PT
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Bluey, the content of tr's posts is far more thought-provoking and inspiring than your knuckle-dragger diatribes. Creatively, she dances rainbows around you, and tends to lift her readers up.
-RainbowJello
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Captain...or Skully
Big Wall climber
leading the away team, but not in a red shirt!
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Nov 26, 2010 - 07:40pm PT
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Word.
Plus, I hear she tears it up on 'er Gaytray. Yowza!
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Nov 26, 2010 - 08:01pm PT
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LOL
Charlie Fowler said climbing was in his anglo-saxon blood. His ancestors were fowlers who made their living on the cliffs recovering fowl and their eggs.
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Anastasia
climber
hanging from a crimp and crying for my mama.
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Nov 26, 2010 - 08:41pm PT
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You are white Tessa because when you sit in a classroom, you easily blend in just like I do despite my Greek heritage.
You are "not white" when you can walk into a room and no one has to ask if you are black/hispanic/native/asian/indian/arab because it is that apparent.
----
As for why people of minority don't climb, here is an answer...
Many people who have left rural areas as field workers are not interested in going back for a visit to nature. Those who grew up in the inner city are afraid of nature and... The majority of immigrants are here because they want the luxuries of U.S... Well, they are into hanging out in malls, not off of a wall.
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Mighty Hiker
climber
Vancouver, B.C.
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Nov 26, 2010 - 08:43pm PT
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i'm just glad thanksday is over and we can now openly listen to christmas music. you know you've been secretly listening to it in your car for over 2 weeks. or maybe that's just me
Awwwk! Run and hide! She's reading our minds.
The Christmas 'music' ear virus cannot be avoided.
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Dr.Sprock
Boulder climber
I'm James Brown, Bi-atch!
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Nov 26, 2010 - 08:46pm PT
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im a frickin minority in the gay area,
fish heads and hosttetlers everywhere,
get me away from the people who took over my jobs and real estate,
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Dr.Sprock
Boulder climber
I'm James Brown, Bi-atch!
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Nov 26, 2010 - 08:53pm PT
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i'm a native american, dammit,
i want my reperations, And my land back.
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Anastasia
climber
hanging from a crimp and crying for my mama.
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Nov 26, 2010 - 09:16pm PT
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"Grumble, grumble..."
I actually hate Christmas music unless it really is Christmas Eve/Day, church, or there are carrolers singing on my doorstep. Listening it in a store, T.V. or radio is just too commercialized for me.
AFS
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Captain...or Skully
Big Wall climber
leading the away team, but not in a red shirt!
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Nov 26, 2010 - 09:19pm PT
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Put me down as Anti Xmas Music. Yeesh.
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RDB
Social climber
wa
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Nov 26, 2010 - 09:55pm PT
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You two should just get a room.
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Captain...or Skully
Big Wall climber
leading the away team, but not in a red shirt!
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Nov 26, 2010 - 10:17pm PT
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Hey, Crawley. Right or wrong, don't be a Dick.
Please?
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Anastasia
climber
hanging from a crimp and crying for my mama.
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Nov 27, 2010 - 01:33am PT
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Crowley,
I am so glad you back... Hilarious man.
AFS
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Mighty Hiker
climber
Vancouver, B.C.
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Nov 27, 2010 - 02:52am PT
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Do you guys mind? Skully and I are having a conversation about christmas "music", and you keep interrupting with your ad hominems. Sheesh!
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Captain...or Skully
Big Wall climber
leading the away team, but not in a red shirt!
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Nov 27, 2010 - 07:57am PT
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Bing or Bob?
Hey, they were dorky white guys, too!
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Nov 27, 2010 - 09:26am PT
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hey there say, all....
from what steve l, said... i can share along this lines
of his quote:
most latinos are very family oriented. Leaving for an entire day or for multiple days without the entire family just doesn't happen. Most of my cousins will go play soccer on a saturday morning and then come back and spend the weekend doing stuff with their own families and with the broader extended family.
in south texas, first off....
it's flat, so nothing to tempt kids to want to climb, except
the ol' mesquite trees... ;)
but what i really had to share is this:
kids learn from the parents, also--in south texas, many kids follow
the dads or uncles, into the music field, and such down there (IF they know someone doing it--music is very much to be esteemed there)...
next, too, family is what folks take pride in, and every day or weekend ends up family time...
hunting and fishing, being that the arroyo, and the gulf, in south texas, calls to many a kid, finds folks FISHING, not seeking out rock--fishing is afordable to ALL families, too, after the fishing license, that is...
my kids, half mexican, were a bit more veritile as to learning about rocks, and the great out doors, being that they SAW a lot of that, in CALIF when they were younger, and the greatoutdoors national parks, intriqued their imagination, and never left (they saw it each time we visited my folks home)...
thus when we always traveled back home to texas, they never lost the feel or love for it--but we had no money for them to pursue anything so "far off",.... (any trips to calif, were national guard trips, for my now-ex to get to san diego, then)...
now, surfing, also rarer in south texas, then, but not so much now, was something that my one son took to follow--course, he got into that from calilfornia, as well....
so i said most of that, as to being:it depends a lot on where you grow up,and what your cultural area nearby is doing, and how open your heart is to exploring--and if the call of the wild is somehow in YOUR PERSONAL CHARACTER, and if you have funds to do so, and pick a "new way of life"... even now, after the few bouts of explorying:
south texas, and upbring have won out:
it is FAMILY, bar-b-q, and hanging out in the yard, and putting money into the kids, that they are most happy with--though they do love road trips--but can't afford them...
lastly, my grandson, mexican-american, as well, has followed his dad's family oriented life... family is everything and--trying to survive and be HERE for them....
(the ol' tex-mex, just moved up here, now, is all)--but, as culture around michigan is HOCKEY (never see climbing mentioned)(though, hunting, is, and speed skating, at times, and of course, SNOWBOARDING), he is now playing for hockey teams and moving up in skill and oportunity (which can be odd,as years back hockey in this area, and still is, in many spots, a "white guy background" type thing...
*he DID love climbing with chappy, at yosemite, for a visit though... :)
also:
same with the girl, grandkids in soccer now, they are all playing, but around here, you don't hear of folks wanting to climb--more mexican names are getting choice spots on these soccer teams, due to hard work... as more famiies grow, here...
okay, i reckon that's my share... :)
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Tony Bird
climber
Northridge, CA
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Nov 27, 2010 - 09:48am PT
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all christmas music is ad hominem--per omnia saecula saeculorum.
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Rhodo-Router
Gym climber
wussing off the topout on Roadside Attraction
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Nov 30, 2010 - 08:25am PT
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No Christmas music on this here tree lot.
Rob
cranking old sonic youth whenever he feels like it
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Fluoride
Trad climber
Hollywood, CA
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Nov 30, 2010 - 10:04am PT
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What the real question should be is...
"Why did so many climbers end up being engineers?".
ding ding ding JACKPOT.
I've never met another climber with a jouralism degree. Everyone in my field thinks I'm insane for wanting to climb. Probably 80% of my climbing partners over the years have been engineering types.
I guess it's the problem solving thing. Most climbers are mathmatically inclined. I'm a rare exception. I suck at math and just climb cause it's fun.
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Tony Bird
climber
Northridge, CA
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Nov 30, 2010 - 10:26am PT
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We're descended from people who valued their freedom and independence (or at least their lives) or sought their fortunes enough to leave their extended families in Europe and strike out on their own.
well, a lot of them were kicked out of europe because europe got so damn crowded and they found themselves believing the wrong things. kicked out in a nice way, of course.
alpinism didn't really get started until the 19th century. it was a product of imagination. the swiss had lived with their alps for centuries, millenia, i guess, but never thought it was important to go up to a summit. for the island-bound british, it became a mania. somehow, that seems best caught by bluegrass:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=szAd9lMUXEA&feature=related
exploration is a fairly natural instinct, especially if things aren't hunky-dory at home sweet home. polynesian peoples did some rather impressive seafaring long before the vikings started hopping across northern islands.
no journalism degree here, fluoride, but have been city editor, managing editor, regional editor and darkroom flunkie. i studied poetry, realized very late in life what a great engineer i might have been, and am probably the only person on ST who thinks the skills are related.
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Gary
climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
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Nov 30, 2010 - 11:00am PT
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Hey, Tony. You couldn't get a good article outta LeRoy? You must not have been trying. :-)
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FRUMY
Trad climber
SHERMAN OAKS,CA
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Nov 30, 2010 - 12:51pm PT
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cause there ain't nothen else we can do. we think we can but no all we can do is climb & or drink beer. oh one mistake we can complain!
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Gary
climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
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Nov 30, 2010 - 01:07pm PT
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virgil's the talkative one.
Really? :-)
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survival
Big Wall climber
A Token of My Extreme
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Nov 30, 2010 - 01:13pm PT
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Wow, I thought this was about dorky white guy climbers.
Turns out it's about Crowley and Skipt having a tongue fight and Christmas music.......
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survival
Big Wall climber
A Token of My Extreme
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Nov 30, 2010 - 01:15pm PT
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BWA HA HAhahahaaa!!
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