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Banquo
Trad climber
Morgan Hill, CA (Mo' Hill)
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Topic Author's Original Post - Nov 1, 2010 - 10:01pm PT
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In an earlier topic I fooled around with drilling out wedge bolts but I didn't manage it. I still think that a 1/2" hollow core drill would work if the 3/8" bolt was left in place to guide the core bit. I don't have a deep enough core bit to try this. If I was handy at brazing or silver soldering or some such thing, I could extend one of the bits I have and try it.
http://www.supertopo.com/climbing/thread.php?topic_id=1268908
This evening I decided to see if I could get a hold of the little sleeve and pull it out. I placed a 3/8" anchor in a 2-1/4" deep drilled hole to the usual depth and tightened it up. I then pulled out the bolt leaving the cone and sleeve. I used a punch and knocked the cone into the bottom of the hole. I tried several ways of getting a hold of the sleeve but most tended to expand the sleeve and I thought they would make it hard to pull. I tried various screws, lags and an ez-out. I felt that I needed to cut into the sleeve rather than expand it and dug through my junk until I found a tap that was about the right size - 8mm of all things from my VW repair days. I wound the tap in and yanked the sleeve out. I then fished the wedge out with a magnet.
I think it worked because i didn't expand the sleeve, it was surprisingly loose and started to spin after cutting less than a full turn of thread.
Prolly won't work with old rusted in bolts but a really stuck one might hold while you cut more threads then pull with bolt. I pulled mine out by hand with the tap.
I need a super strong rare earth magnet to fish out the wedge since it was balky.
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Thorgon
Big Wall climber
Sedro Woolley, WA
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Banquo~
Way to stick to it, Man!!
Thor
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ionlyski
Trad climber
Kalispell, Montana
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Banquo,
Did you make your bolt puller? Is it about an inch and a quarter bolt with the shaft drilled and tapped to 3/8"?
Impressive.
When I have pulled 3/8 wedge bolts they just broke off at about the half way point, not at the wedge.
Arne
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mucci
Trad climber
The pitch of Bagalaar above you
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That looks like a useable rig....
How did you get the cone out? Tap?
Workshops rule.
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Clint Cummins
Trad climber
SF Bay area, CA
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Victory!
Stainless or non-stainless wedge bolt?
(I'm wondering about the magnetic attraction of the stainless).
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Brian in SLC
Social climber
Salt Lake City, UT
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Wow, I've always wondered if a system like that might work...neat!
Stainless or non-stainless wedge bolt?
(I'm wondering about the magnetic attraction of the stainless).
'Bout have to be non-stainless. I have a really strong rare earth magnet, and, it barely picks a stainless bolt up off the floor, much less out of a hole. Almost need pliers to get that magnet off the 'fridge.
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Mighty Hiker
climber
Vancouver, B.C.
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You should have titled this one "New way of chopping bolts" - would've gotten dozens of posts by now.
Thanks for posting about your various endeavours with anchors, as they're quite interesting, and often relevant.
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Larry
Trad climber
Bisbee
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What're the details on this rare earth magnet? Something you can get at Ace Hardware, or not? Source?
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Banquo
Trad climber
Morgan Hill, CA (Mo' Hill)
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Topic Author's Reply - Nov 2, 2010 - 08:47pm PT
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Just google shop for rare earth magnet. I have some I got by taking apart old hard disc drives. The really old drives had big ones in them.
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SuperCow
Social climber
Cambridge
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They are called Neodymium magnets. Dangerously strong !
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randy88fj62
Trad climber
LA, CA
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I have be perusing the bolt removal threads and my current project requires removing old rusted 3/8 and 5/16 bolts. Not sure what hardware was used with the Leeper hangers. Threaded rod sticking out with a nut over the leeper hanger.
Tried using two piton tuning forks, a bosch chisel tuning fork (made one after reading its use here), and a crowbar.
I ended up snapping the bolt just above the rock surface creating an ugly scar on the rock.
I have roughly 20 of these bolts to remove so I'd like to make a puller as shown in the two main threads here.
My question is regarding the acme threaded rod which is best for loads. What are people using for the threaded collar / nut spacer?
Tapping threaded rod to accept the bolts I am pulling is easy. I am trying to avoid buying an ACME die and making my own collar.
Are there any long threaded ACME nuts with good tensile strength or other threaded fittings I could adapt to?
http://www.mcmaster.com/#acme-threaded-rods/=12c4xh6
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tradmanclimbs
Ice climber
Pomfert VT
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XDrill right next to the 3/8th in bolt w/ 1/2" bit. so close that you touch the side of the old bolt just barely. Hog it out, tap with hammer, yank out the old crapola. Hogg out a bit more and then place counter sunk 10mm glue in.
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randy88fj62
Trad climber
LA, CA
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The bolts at my disposal are not glue ins. My goal is to forcefully pull out the bolts.
The access fund website recommends modifying a C clamp which is an option I am considering.
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mike m
Trad climber
black hills
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May 10, 2016 - 10:22am PT
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This is of great interest and I think it is the best thing to preserve bolted routes in their original holes.
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overwatch
climber
Arizona
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May 10, 2016 - 11:06am PT
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I read somewhere probably on this forum about magnets that are so strong you have to have a special license to handle them? Like so strong that if you get your hand between the magnet and metal say goodbye to your hand?
I don't know about the license thing that may be bullshit
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BruceHildenbrand
Social climber
Mountain View/Boulder
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May 10, 2016 - 12:04pm PT
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The access fund website recommends modifying a C clamp which is an option I am considering.
Actually, this is a two part process for removing 3/8" wedge bolts. First, you use an adapter with your power drill to spin the wedge bolt in the hole which effectively destroys the cone. Next, you hook up some sort of puller either something hydraulic or the C clamp thing to pull the stud out.
This process works very well for wedge bolts. There is a low weight, hydraulic puller which you can buy for $150 to do the pulling. That information should be available on the AF website of you can E-mail 'greggonator' here on SuperTopo.
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G_Gnome
Trad climber
Cali
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May 10, 2016 - 12:25pm PT
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Great work but now someone needs to figure out how to remove Petzl long life bolts!
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Chossboss
Trad climber
The GNAR
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May 10, 2016 - 01:42pm PT
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Why would you ever need to pull a long life?
I thought those things were good for, like, eternity.
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tolman_paul
Trad climber
Anchorage, AK
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May 10, 2016 - 02:23pm PT
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Great work but now someone needs to figure out how to remove Petzl long life bolts!
It should be fairly easy. Drill out the center expansion pin and then it should pull right out.
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randy88fj62
Trad climber
LA, CA
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May 10, 2016 - 02:34pm PT
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Bruce,
I have access to a basic machine shop. I am trying to avoid buying a hydraulic puller. Hence the C-Clamp comment.
I am also interested in Banquo's puller design since it's not bulky.
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JimT
climber
Munich
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May 10, 2016 - 10:29pm PT
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It should be fairly easy. Drill out the center expansion pin and then it should pull right out.
Sure, drilling 2" of stainless steel pin is real simple up on the cliff. Especially by hand :-)
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BruceHildenbrand
Social climber
Mountain View/Boulder
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May 11, 2016 - 08:42am PT
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randy88fj62,
at the recent Access Fund's Future of Fixed Anchors II conference at Red Rocks a guy from Tucson made a puller similar to Banquo's. It was very nice and pulled a lot of bolts including a Powers 5-piece from limestone.
BTW, when you are spinning the bolt to destroy the cone, using some jewelry grit mixed in water helps more quickly tear up the cone.
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Coach37
Social climber
Philly
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May 11, 2016 - 09:21am PT
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I went along with a guy that used to post here to do some removal several years ago. He pulled wedge bolts by just prying on it with a 3' crowbar, then hammering the stud back in the hole a little, pry on it again, tap it back in, and so on.
Eventually the sleeve around the cone end of the bolt busted into pieces and the bolts pulled. We chopped many 3/8" this way, but were unsuccessful for 1/2". It took maybe 5 min per bolt for most of them, with an occasional stubborn one.
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rick d
climber
ol pueblo, az
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May 11, 2016 - 09:41am PT
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randy land cruiser owner
I don't think the bolts are cooked yet and not ready to come out. They sound like split shafts not wedge bolts. I would put a new hanger on them with tag on them to ID them. Maybe another 10 years they will be ready to pull. The other alternative is grind off the heads and fill with cordless grinder and redrill adjacent to them, but unattractive.
This rebolting issue may have some valid points, but I climb 1,000's of shitty 1-40 year old bolts each year and most are solid (enough).
rick land cruiser owner
/desert climber exclusively
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randy88fj62
Trad climber
LA, CA
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May 11, 2016 - 01:48pm PT
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Thank you for the replies. I am in fact an landcruiser owner (1988 FJ62) as you could tell.
The bolts I am concerned about are on a steep overhanging roof. If one were to pop I would be concerned that the rest would zipper.
The bolts are well rusted along with the Leeper hangers. The bolts are in sandstone and there is a 2-3 foot streak of rust color below each bolt as if the water was pulling the iron oxide out and staining the rock.
While these bolts may be 'good enough' I would like to make sure they are bomber by replacing them. They are over 20 years old and they are due for some love.
I'll try the pry bar method and I'll try banquo's tool without the J threads as normal threads are tapping to fit the bolt heads is cheap.
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Chossboss
Trad climber
The GNAR
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May 11, 2016 - 03:24pm PT
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Randy,
You might also try grinding a 3/8"x6" grove down the center of a splitting wedge. It's really just a big tuning fork. With a 4 pound sledge those wedge bolts walk right out.
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randy88fj62
Trad climber
LA, CA
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May 12, 2016 - 08:06am PT
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The problem is the bolts are rusted. I used these three tuning forks and the one bolt I have tried working on broke right above the surface of the rock.
My tuning forks and the Stainless bolts I replaced them with:
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| Messages 1 - 28 of total 28 in this topic |
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