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BoKu
Trad climber
Douglas Flat, CA
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Nov 12, 2005 - 12:35am PT
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I think it's a nutcase with too much time on his hands.
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bryan howell
Big Wall climber
truckee,ca
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Nov 12, 2005 - 01:04am PT
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what a disgraceful sham of a report.
Way to honor the 343 and all the other innocents that died that day.
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Hootervillian
climber
back at Zak's cabin
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Topic Author's Reply - Nov 12, 2005 - 01:24am PT
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how about we 'honor' them by bringing their murderers to justice, or just more license plate rings, whichever you prefer.
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WoodyS
Trad climber
Riverside
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Nov 12, 2005 - 02:20am PT
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I knew the French would hit us sooner or later. Nuke Paris.
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WoodyS
Trad climber
Riverside
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Nov 12, 2005 - 02:22am PT
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Hootervillian, time for your meds. Then go quietly back to your room.
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bryan howell
Big Wall climber
truckee,ca
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Nov 12, 2005 - 02:29am PT
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lol,
too funny. I suppose Lee Harvey Oswald didn't act alone either?
I suppose Neil Armstrong really didn't land on the moon?
and I suppose Big Brother watches us through our TVs and tracks us via GPS through our phones to make sure we are staying in line?
Im not going to try and even act like I am a knowledagble person when it comes to what happen that day and why the buildings failed. But I will tell you what I do know.
Im a fireman. I know fire VERY well. I also know building construction. . VERY well.
I know that jet fuel burns a hell of a lot hotter than your standard BTUs released from wood. Thats why crash rescue units at airports wear the funny tin foil suits. because jet fuel burns HOTTER. hot enough to melt steel. hot enough to warp everything around it just from radiant heat waves.
I also know that when 2 multi-ton buildings fall over, the ground shakes. and other construction all around it, WILL be effected. and when you add more heat, and warp more construction. . . guess what???? fall down go boom.
I also dont understand why the majority of our forces are in Iraq, when OBL is still cowering around elsewhere. If we are so sure that he did it, then why aren't we concentrating on him? We already got Saddam. who wasn't involved what so ever in 9-11. I would like to see everone who died that day revenged. But our own government didnt do that. sorry. I believe in america. If our government was responsable, then we should all be a muslim nation.
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Bob Jones
Trad climber
san luis obispo
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Nov 12, 2005 - 02:35am PT
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uhuh. just like we never really went to the moon right?
bullsh*t.
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Crimpergirl
Sport climber
St. Louis
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Nov 12, 2005 - 08:53am PT
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One question: What did the govt do with all the people who were on flight 77 if no 757 hit the Pentagon? The nutjobs don't seem to address that 'small' detail.
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bryan howell
Big Wall climber
truckee,ca
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Nov 12, 2005 - 09:53am PT
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didn't you know?
Our ally aliens abducted them, and they are curently preparing colonization on Mars.
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Crimpergirl
Sport climber
St. Louis
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Nov 12, 2005 - 10:00am PT
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Ohhhh. That's why the Mar's probe. It's all coming together now.
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Hootervillian
climber
back at Zak's cabin
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Topic Author's Reply - Nov 12, 2005 - 11:10am PT
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you know, the reactions and acceptabilities towards 'OBL starts Intifada in France', 'The French' and 'Building Number Seven' have certainly been an interesting expose into the 'acceptance' of 'conspiracy theories'.
It seemed to have taken very little for many to get comfortable that 'race' riots in France were a terrorist uprising associated with OBL, with not even a 'nutjob' physics professor from BYU to 'link'.
Bryan you asked the trillion dollar question, you satisfied with the answer?
Crimpergirl, good to read you in a political forum.
WoodyS, someday would you show me how to make a potato gun?
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mark miller
Social climber
Reno
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Nov 12, 2005 - 11:24am PT
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The only way to get Americans to War is by attacking them at home..... Leave no billionares behind. What's the life of a few thousand people when your controlling the world?
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Crimpergirl
Sport climber
St. Louis
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Nov 12, 2005 - 11:45am PT
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Hootie:
Thanks. Happy to be here. I read most of these threads - political included. I just generally don't post my (irrelevent) opinion.
The 9-11 stuff does hit a nerve with me though. I was there (D.C.) and lived this day. Words cannot express the utter fecking fear and chaos. (There was an almost total lack of news coverage of this - Much of what was reported was simply false). Granted, I was not in the Pentagon, and yet, my experience (as well as others) was beyond words horrible.
I do wonder why these conspiracy theories do not discuss what happened to the people on flight 77 though. I'm willing to entertain these explanations, but it seems they've not taken on a huge gap in their own theory. Or maybe I just missed it.
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Hootervillian
climber
back at Zak's cabin
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Topic Author's Reply - Nov 12, 2005 - 12:13pm PT
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your opinion is never irrelevent. Lot's of 'holes' in theory's, I don't remember the one where 'no planes hit pentagon'. any links?
There also seem to be a lot of 'holes' in our reaction and subsequent action, as well as a level of comfortability with some very dubious 'justice'.
I want answers. I have a brother and a cousin in Iraq. Those 'crazy' muslims did it is ridiculous, especially considering we continue to support and arm radical, muslim nuclear powers to the teeth.
It seems the 'emotional' trail and the 'money' trail parted some time ago.
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Crimpergirl
Sport climber
St. Louis
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Nov 12, 2005 - 12:56pm PT
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I don't have the links anymore, but at least one group is saying it was a missile that hit the pentagon. I worked in the government and have two questions/thoughts:
1) How can the gubmit I worked for be so coordinated as to pull off something requiring so much coordination?
(When in the gubmit, people would often question why certain things were done. The question I felt people should be asking was "how the hell does anything ever get done?")
2) why do all of this for a war?
It would have been much easier (i.e., less coordination) for Bush to take a bullet (get wounded, not killed) by supposed 'terrorists.' This would serve at least two purposes. First, it was rally the country around the flag, and it would mobilize the country against the 'enemy.' Second, it would boost Bush's approval ratings with the public (see Reagan's approval ratings before and after his assasination attempt - it's a sure fire (ha ha no pun intended) way to get additional support. Fo president's, public support is the currency by which they rule and have power).
While at DOJ, I have seen and been involved in the fall-out of distortions made by people in this administration on relatively unimportant topics. I can only wonder the depth of distortions on topics that are very very important (e.g., war - oh wait, it's not a war is it? Never declared... the "????" in Iraq).
I'm certainly open to 'conspiracy' theories, but for this one, they need to answer some more answers for me.
I'm sorry to hear that you have loved ones over there (many of us do). I hope that they come home soon and safe.
Think this post is a bit rambling. Hopefully it makes some sense.
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WoodyS
Trad climber
Riverside
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Nov 13, 2005 - 02:20pm PT
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Okay, I'm going to be serious for a bit. Hypothetically, let's assume that a cabal of Americans wanted to get us into a war by some nefarious scheme. They do this by attacking the US in some violent manner and shift the blame to an enemy. Said attack, to succeed would have to be as simple as possible and would have to be carried out with the smallest number of highly competent and trustworthy experts in such matters. The more people involved and the more complex the plan, the greater the probability of failure. Let's stay with the Twin Towers since it would be spectacular: symbolism of American Capitalism and power. It would also garner world wide attention and shock-obviously it did. I believe this could be done. Remember how close the original attack came to success. In truth, I believe other attacks across the US, simultaneously on malls, sports stadiums etc. would have had a greater impact; but this is debatable.
The direction of the conspiracy manifested by the sites initiating this discussion would require scores to hundreds of conspirators in a scheme so complex as to stun the imagination of anyone seriously examining the issue. Crimpergirl brought up the passengers on the Pentagon flight as a hole not addressed by the conspiracy people. Okay, possibly they were all kidnapped, shot and buried out in the middle of Greenland somewhere. And then there is the co-ordination between the terrorists flying the planes and the bombers that set off the explosives in the Towers. All these people would have to be part of the plot. Sure, American suicide bombers disguised as Saudi terrorists co-operating with American saboteurs. Or, maybe, they were Saudis working for the American cabal, or possibly OBL is a CIA double agent working for us and Mossad in a grand scheme to get the US to attack Iraq, or...I need an aspirin. One thing for sure, the number of people required for this conspiracy would negate it; that would require something quite impossible among the species: all would have to keep their mouths shut. Oh, wait a sec, that's been taken care of: another set of assassins has knocked off the scores or hundreds of the initial set of assassins and buried them in the middle of the Mojave. Now the third set of assassins will...
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can't say
Social climber
Pasadena CA
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Nov 13, 2005 - 02:31pm PT
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Hey Woody
Did you ever make your students use paragraphs???
Cause you really should try it more often, seriously now..:)
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