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the Fet
Knackered climber
A bivy sack in the secret campground
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Bump- because this was the last post on the 1st page of results.
Also, any thoughts on Grade 5 vs. stainless machinehead rivets?
Replacing a blown placement with a 5/16 x 3/4" stainless machinehead is really the best option to restore the climbability of the route and not diminish the comittment. Machineheads, if properly placed, have reasonable service life but generally cannot be relied upon to hold lengthy falls due to rivet hanger cable failure.
Why is this is a better option than a 1/4" rawl buttonhead (split shaft)? Seems like for the long term viability of the placement the rawl would be much easier to remove and replace in the same hole if needed. Too bomber?
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WBraun
climber
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Fet
I agree with you. There's no difference between the bolt sizes except the brains of the fools who discriminate that for a rivet/bolt ladder they have to be a certain way.
I remember we used whatever was the cheapest or whatever was laying around to use for bolt ladders figuring later people would beef them up and make them more robust.
Aid climbing is such an inflated ego trip by some.
Flame away as I don't give a sh#t about all these ego maniacs and their screwed up idiotic bolt and rivet philosophy's.
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Mimi
climber
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But Werner?! Doesn't the larger quandry of the hole being half full or half empty intrigue you anymore? You know, the ol' yin yang thang.
You know it matters to our pea-sized brains. Cut us some slack would ya.
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Mimi
climber
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Dude, is that some kind of fishing tackle item? Or are you just in love with old school dowels?
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WBraun
climber
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That's a dumb ass way of doing it, fixed cables. They wear out so quickly and then you end up with the same time bomb scenario you get with fixed heads.
Sh#t ???????? Like WTF man?
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Mimi
climber
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I think Klaus was kidding and showing us a great example of serious mank.
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WBraun
climber
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Damn Mimi, you're right as usual .........
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Tarbuster
climber
right here, right now
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Yes Werner, Klaus just trolled you.
It's OK bro, happens to all of us.
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Mimi
climber
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Werner, promise me you'll always be my friend (and my brother).
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WBraun
climber
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Hahaha yeah Klaus has trolled me too many times to count. I'm a sorry ass sucker!
Mimi you are an eternal friend always ........
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deuce4
Big Wall climber
the Southwest
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Klaus, don't forget the technique of applying a good sharp chisel to blank rock to make a bomber #2 head groove in a few minutes. Super bomb squad!
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Mimi
climber
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I share your sentiments, Werner.
Deuce, enter and trench thy head please!
Fet, it's been brought to my attention that one reason not to place a 1/4" split shaft anymore is that you can't get them in stainless. The split shaft design, even 3/8", is flawed for climbing use because the metal gets so fatigued during fabrication and subsequent placement. Stress fracturing is a considerable problem. Mild steel bolts and chromally hangers of any kind should be right out. The closest thing that Powers/Rawl make in stainless is a bent shaft spike.
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deuce4
Big Wall climber
the Southwest
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There are plenty of examples of the technique on the boulder behind Werner's old van spot in Camp 4!
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golsen
Social climber
kennewick, wa
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Well, you guys are way beyond me. I would have figured that a bat hook was less intrusive and damaging as anything permanent. If you are going to stick metal in there, whats wrong with a buttonhead? I used to think those were pretty damn good.
Now you are saying that bolts are too good. OK
But bat hooks are artificial difficulty. OK
But a piece of mank that may fail in 2 plus years is ok. Refferring to klaus pic of the machine head with a wire thingy... WHAT?
Sorry, I just dont get it.
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Mimi
climber
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No, you've been trolled.
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Russ Walling
Social climber
Out on the sand, Man.....
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Klaus: using 1/16" cable is like having nubian fur on yer balls..... nice and all, but it ain't full on wool... drop the size to 3/64ths and you'll be all set.
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clustiere
Trad climber
Durango, CO
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drilling is drilling, so place a bolt make it big, aid climbing is a contrived sport anyway. Don't take that sh#t so seriously, I wish you would have slammed in the steel.
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aldude
climber
Monument Manor
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EK...trolling? I think not. Deadly serious! You see the whole point of establishing a difficult aid testpiece is not to make the route repeatable but rather the opposite. Way more proud to have potential suitors bail on your opus than succeed. Besides FA's are not a service for " the masses " but a personal experience...you know man vs stone...test your mettle kind of quest. Externalities such as popularity,hardware quality and bomber belays merely clutter the task @ hand and diminish the pucker factor sought by the intrepid aid warrior in his glorious endeavor!
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Holdplease2
Big Wall climber
Yosemite area
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Hey Klaus:
Pierre climbed the route in 2003 and is refering to the state of the A3+ hooking at that time, and presently. You can still hook left on a little bit-o-nothin.
The new rockfall that Paul and I are talking about occurred just a few weeks ago from a different party, where the "reachy hook" block was accidentally removed from the climb. A friend of mine was on Skull Queen at the time, saw the rockfall, and spoke with the party after they bailed.
Anyway, something will probably have to be done where the "reachy hook" used to be.
-Kate.
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Pierre
Big Wall climber
Sweden
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Yes Kate, the whole A3+ hooking section was loose the second time I climbed it, I was surprised to find out because the previous year it seemed solid enough.
As far as I can understand; the A3+ section is still loose but has not fallen off yet (the picture with the two equlized heads looks like this section), below the first rivet there is a rock scar and missing features? And new drilled hooks?
Then the route climbs three rivets and the reachy hook move is also gone, that move is a little bit below a small roof and a right facing copperhead corner?
What I was saying in my previous post was that I accidently climbed past the first rivet (didn't have a topo) by hooking, I did a travers to the right - from the A3+ hooking past the first rivet and up to the right maybe five feet and the traversed back left to the rivets once I spotted them (I was worried that I could hit the slab below so I was happy to find the rivets).
I do not think that you can hook out right at the "reachy hook" move and pass that section...
Klaus; maybe I was high - maybe I wasn't, can't remember details like that ;)
I really like this route, especially the hanging curtain, thanks for putting it up - good work man! It states in the topo that rivets were added on pitch 7 - how many did you guys place on that pitch during your climb? Just curious...
peace
(p.s the belay bolts on the route were not very good in -02/03)
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