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Tomcat
Trad climber
Chatham N.H.
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Sep 15, 2011 - 09:44am PT
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Henry still climbs plenty. He's still solid on 5.10, still uses a one inch swami, just stoppers and hexes.I don't think he needs this one route as a testament to his boldness worldwide. My guess is that like many of us, he just doesn't accept retrobolting.I don't either.
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donini
Trad climber
Ouray, Colorado
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Sep 15, 2011 - 10:17am PT
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Hard to believe that Henry, at this date, would fly to the Black Hills to chop the bolt. Henry has put on weight and has evolved into a recreational climber who does not resemble the Hot Henry of lore. He also has other activities (notably fly fishing) that occupy him.
I will say that if you put him on a necky, technical, not too steep route you can still see a master at work.
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Tomcat
Trad climber
Chatham N.H.
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Sep 15, 2011 - 10:18am PT
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More likely Jim, he went to visit friends and climb there...just sayin'.
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Sep 15, 2011 - 11:06am PT
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Yes bolts were added...but who cares?
Clearly someone and there's no short of people who care quite passionately about retrobolting...
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Todd Eastman
climber
Bellingham, WA
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Sep 15, 2011 - 12:36pm PT
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First ascents are competitive, you lost. Now you can go back and do it as the FA was done...
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Brandon-
climber
The Granite State.
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Sep 15, 2011 - 01:12pm PT
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I've got money that says Sarge won't drive to SD to chop a bolt.
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TwistedCrank
climber
Ideeho-dee-do-dah-day boom-chicka-boom-chicka-boom
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Sep 15, 2011 - 01:31pm PT
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I got money.
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Mighty Hiker
climber
Vancouver, B.C.
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Sep 15, 2011 - 01:33pm PT
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Story now has it that he flew out in August and belayed Eric Sutton to do the chopping.
Is the story from a reliable source, i.e. is there a named witness, or has Barber admitted to doing it?
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Jaybro
Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
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Sep 15, 2011 - 02:24pm PT
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Hhhmmm, he (Henry B) was at Devil's Tower July 30th....
Probably just something he did while he was around rather, than coming out specifically for the 'deed'.
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Largo
Sport climber
The Big Wide Open Face
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Sep 15, 2011 - 03:33pm PT
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Many climbers have repeated the route with bolts. Many more climbers are now deprived of one of the Needles most unique summits due to Henry's need too be a legacy building egotist. Nothing good was accomplished by the senseless chopping of these bolts especially after 35 years.
That's a modern view of things. The classical view is that a route was the creation of whoever put it up and everyone after was honest and sporting only if they took the route on its own terms. That didn't include "fixing" the route to fit your fancy. You don't go into the Met and start in on the canvasses with a Sharpie.
Why so?
The notion was that there were plenty of routes to climb and that only a cheat dumbed down an existing route so they could do it. Ragging on someone for running the rope, claiming that they deprived people of "their" experience is to shift ownership of the route from the first ascentionists to whatever poltroon walks up to it now or next year and decides he has the right to climb it however he so chooses and never mind the fist ascent. Die, Henry Barber, and all that jazz. It's all about me and mine.
That's the hardcore line. Both the bold dude who runs the rope and the panty waste who adds bolts to a 35 year old route can be seen as selfish, depending on perspectives. Any way you look at it, adding bolts to old classic routes is a slippery slope.
JL
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Dingus McGee
Social climber
Laramie
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Sep 15, 2011 - 04:33pm PT
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DMT,
ah yes I could go up there and modify, the story is quite amusing, but i say let's permit a placard at the base of this climb commemorating how H Barb got the second ascent of this spire and we'll all forget about Cleveland's much more spectacular unsung first effort (and success).
If every first ascentionist could get one and only one placard at the base of what he thought was his greatest accomplishment and Superpin were in my bag I would not wish the placard placed on it. But WTF I could be bought for $10,000. I suppose I would give my placard to Henry and he could have two as permitted by the donor rules. After all this guy once wrote in a register on the boulder Scab, "All these B1's are bullshit[Gill's]". An anonomous reply followed that read, "Then go try Gill's Thimble route." Can we put Henry's second placard at the base of Scab reading the words that he wrote about the B1's ?? A legend is known by his deeds and words and he will be judged by his words also.
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Sep 15, 2011 - 04:38pm PT
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If I had a dollar for every bolt that has been added to a route I put up (and no doubt subsequently credited to "me"), they would make me little richer but far poorer.
As they have,..
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Dingus McGee
Social climber
Laramie
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Sep 15, 2011 - 04:51pm PT
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Excuse me Ron Anderson,
some of us have the ability to judge by words.......
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bhilden
Trad climber
Mountain View, CA
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Sep 15, 2011 - 05:02pm PT
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The time for Henry to have taken action was when the bolt was first placed. Now, after 35 years of ascents, 'history', as well as Henry, have a say in the condition of the route.
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jstan
climber
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Sep 15, 2011 - 05:26pm PT
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The time for Henry to have taken action was when the bolt was first placed. Now, after 35 years of ascents, 'history', as well as Henry, have a say in the condition of the route.
In a perfect world - yes, certainly.
But in that perfect world the bolt might well not have been placed at all.
We also don't know when it was Henry learned of the bolt. We also do not know for a fact Henry was involved. For that matter, is the bolt gone?
More generally, over the last forty years many have maintained that no matter how offensive we think artificial protection may be, it should be left alone. We felt this way because isolated persons carrying on a war, serves only ill.
A lot has changed. When a bolt is chopped we quickly get threads drawing attention to the fact there is a problem. When there is an already existing coordinated effort by climbers to manage an area, events like this may be needed to get some attention.
I don't think I have changed how I feel. Certainly when self-righteousness is on the scene what should be a success - can become a disaster.
Righteousness is our problem. We will have an answer when we get rid of that.
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Dingus McGee
Social climber
Laramie
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Sep 15, 2011 - 05:27pm PT
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Ron Anderson,
so then by your words its a good thing to retro bolt any climbs one deems risky or dangerous?
do you have any reading comprehension skills?? Where have I said this?
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Dingus McGee
Social climber
Laramie
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Sep 15, 2011 - 05:30pm PT
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jstan,
we do know precisely when Henry learned of the bolt. After belaying the bolter Mr. Ed Sklar headed to the payphone and made a call to Henry. yes, Ed was laughing all the way to the booth. Oh, how I enjoyed his sarcasm. I am the person who conceived the method and did the rescue of Mike Todd. While Mike was rappelling he ask whether he could borrow my bolt kit. Ed said Mike would have fun putting it in and Henry could have fun chopping it. This was 34 years ago.
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jstan
climber
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Sep 15, 2011 - 05:50pm PT
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Dingus:
So really. This is not about the bolt at all?
People just wanted to poke at Henry?
They wanted to do that so badly they were willing to retrobolt a Cleveland route?
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Gilroy
Social climber
Boulderado
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Sep 15, 2011 - 06:03pm PT
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Henry makes himself a big target, as donini alluded. Pretty sure he cares little about the slings and arrows of public opinion. Seems as though the gauntlet was laid down long ago. He just waited awhile before picking it up, perhaps...
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Dingus McGee
Social climber
Laramie
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Sep 15, 2011 - 06:14pm PT
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jstan,
"this" your words--what are its referents??
The bolt means different things to each of us and so does its chopping. Ed Sklar has just won a bet with Mike Todd that he would have to place a bolt on Superpin.
Pokes at Henry? I would think you know this guy? Some of us have an inside story that reveals character enough so that we can understand their motives.
The Cleveland route has no bolts, had no bolts. there are 2 routes on Superpin.
I do no control what goes on after posting a new thread.
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