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TGT
Social climber
So Cal
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Nov 10, 2010 - 02:41pm PT
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What he said!
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Jaybro
Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
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Nov 10, 2010 - 02:42pm PT
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ballistic Matso igniting swamp gas....
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Gene
Social climber
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Nov 10, 2010 - 02:44pm PT
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Aliens going back home.
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Captain...or Skully
Big Wall climber
leading the away team, but not in a red shirt!
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Nov 10, 2010 - 02:44pm PT
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Dr. Evil?
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monolith
climber
Berkeley, CA
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Nov 10, 2010 - 02:51pm PT
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Yep, visual perspective in important, so we can't be sure it rose from the ocean. Too slow to be a military missile as well.
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ddriver
Trad climber
SLC, UT
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Nov 10, 2010 - 02:52pm PT
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Believe it or not. Pics don't come with:
November 10, 2010 -- Pentagon and its embedded media covering up Chinese show of force off LA
China flexed its military muscle Monday evening in the skies west of Los Angeles when a Chinese Navy Jin class ballistic missile nuclear submarine, deployed secretly from its underground home base on the south coast of Hainan island, launched an intercontinental ballistic missile from international waters off the southern California coast. WMR's intelligence sources in Asia, including Japan, say the belief by the military commands in Asia and the intelligence services is that the Chinese decided to demonstrate to the United States its capabilities on the eve of the G-20 Summit in Seoul and the Asia-Pacific Economic Cooperation summit in Tokyo, where President Obama is scheduled to attend during his ten-day trip to Asia.
The reported Chinese missile test off Los Angeles came as a double blow to Obama. The day after the missile firing, China's leading credit rating agency, Dagong Global Credit Rating, downgraded sovereign debt rating of the United States to A-plus from AA. The missile demonstration coupled with the downgrading of the United States financial grade represents a military and financial show of force by Beijing to Washington.
The Pentagon spin machine, backed by the media reporters who regularly cover the Defense Department, as well as officials of the Federal Aviation Administration (FAA), North American Aerospace Defense Command (NORAD), and the U.S. Northern Command, is now spinning various conspiracy theories, including describing the missile plume videotaped by KCBS news helicopter cameraman Gil Leyvas at around 5:00 pm Pacific Standard Time, during the height of evening rush hour, as the condensation trail from a jet aircraft. Other Pentagon-inspired cover stories are that the missile was actually an amateur rocket or an optical illusion.
Experts agree that this was a ballistic missile being fired off of Los Angeles. Pentagon insists it was a jet aircraft or model rocket.
There are no records of a plane in the area having taken off from Los Angeles International Airport or from other airports in the region. The Navy and Air Force have said that they were not conducting any missile tests from submarines, ships, or Vandenberg Air Force Base. The Navy has also ruled out an accidental firing from one of its own submarines.
Missile experts, including those from Jane's in London, say the plume was definitely from a missile, possibly launched from a submarine. WMR has learned that the missile was likely a JL-2 ICBM, which has a range of 7,000 miles, and was fired in a northwesterly direction over the Pacific and away from U.S. territory from a Jin class submarine. The Jin class can carry up to twelve such missiles.
Navy sources have revealed that the missile may have impacted on Chinese territory and that the National Security Agency (NSA) likely posseses intercepts of Chinese telemtry signals during the missile firing and subsequent testing operations.
Japanese and other Asian intelligence agencies believe that a Chinese Jin-class SSBN submarine conducted missile "show of force" in skies west of Los Angeles.
Asian intelligence sources believe the submarine transited from its base on Hainan through South Pacific waters, where U.S. anti-submarine warfare detection capabilities are not as effective as they are in the northern and mid-Pacific, and then transited north to waters off of Los Angeles. The Pentagon, which has spent billions on ballistic missile defense systems, a pet project of former Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld, is clearly embarrassed over the Chinese show of strength.
Likely route of Jin-class submarine from Hainan base.
The White House also wants to donwplay the missile story before Presidnet Obama meets with his Chinese counterpart in Seoul and Tokyo. According to Japanese intelligence sources, Beijing has been angry over United States and allied naval exercises in the South China and Yellow Seas, in what China considers its sphere of influence, and the missile firing within the view of people in Southern California was a demonstration that China's navy can also play in waters off the American coast.
For the U.S. Navy, the Chinese show of force is a huge embarassment, especially for the Navy's Pacific Command in Pearl Harbor, where Japan's December 7, 1941 attack on the fleet at Pearl Harbor remains a sore subject.
In 2002, national security adviser Condoleezza Rice reportedly scolded visiting Chinese General Xiong Guankai, the deputy chief of staff for intelligence of the People's Liberation Army, for remarks he allegedly made in 1995 that China would use nuclear weapons on Los Angeles. Xiong denied he made any such comments but the "spin" on the story helped convince Congress to sink billions of additional dollars into ballistic missile defense, sometimes referred to at "Star Wars II."
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Ghost
climber
A long way from where I started
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Nov 10, 2010 - 02:53pm PT
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Aliens going back home.
I don't think it was aliens going home, but rather a couple STers (you know who they are) headed up to rendezvous with the aliens on the dark side of the moon. If we see another unexplainable "missile" in a day or so, we'll know they're back.
Meanwhile, keep track of who hasn't posted since the sighting.
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Tony Bird
climber
Northridge, CA
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Nov 10, 2010 - 02:59pm PT
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heck, just an advertisement--we get them all the time over venice beach--goodyear blimp, little biplanes pulling "caca-colo" signs. now a missile saying "shop chinese".
btw, 35 miles north of catalina island would have the submarine running aground on venice beach.
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monolith
climber
Berkeley, CA
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Nov 10, 2010 - 03:04pm PT
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Nice find GC.
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bmacd
Trad climber
100% Canadian
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Nov 10, 2010 - 03:06pm PT
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ddriver please post a link to that informtive article
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Mighty Hiker
climber
Vancouver, B.C.
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Nov 10, 2010 - 03:07pm PT
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In the very unlikely event that it was a missile launched from a Chinese submarine:
1. It would have been an IRBM, not an ICBM.
2. Do the Chinese have such capabilities?
3. They would almost certainly have notified the US military before the launch - see below.
4. There would be abundant, indeed overwhelming, ground and satellite data on what happened.
A surprise missile launch from a foreign submarine (probably not "unknown" or "stealth") in US coastal waters would very likely be treated as an attack, inviting immediate retaliation. Given the short time frames involved, and the uncertainty as to target(s), hard to do anything else. It seems extremely likely that it wasn't a missile launch.
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Jaybro
Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
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Nov 10, 2010 - 03:11pm PT
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Ironman III
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jstan
climber
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Nov 10, 2010 - 03:16pm PT
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We have a pretty extensive sonar network off all of our coasts. Even were the submarine not detected directly( dubious) the launch of the missile should have been. Lot of cavitation in a missile launch and at a very suggestive pass band. Cavitation makes it very hard to conceal high speed screws so that will be a pass band of high interest.
And oh. The last thing the Navy would do is confirm this and thus allow our national technical means to be gauged.
Read GC's link.
http://uncinus.wordpress.com/2010/11/09/4/
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Mighty Hiker
climber
Vancouver, B.C.
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Nov 10, 2010 - 03:18pm PT
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They have a special on IRBMs this week. Aisle 666.
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Klimmer
Mountain climber
San Diego
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Nov 10, 2010 - 03:22pm PT
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http://www.waynemadsenreport.com/articles/20101110
Wayne Madsen Report.
Wayne is a very brave soul. Former Navy and NSA agent.
To read the article you have to be a paying member.
I've learned a great deal over the years from Wayne Madsen.
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TomCochrane
Trad climber
Santa Cruz Mountains and Monterey Bay
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Nov 10, 2010 - 03:28pm PT
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you can usually visually identify a missile that exits the atmosphere by seeing the contrail bloom out sideways into a dramatically wider trail as the vehicle transits out of the atmosphere and atmospheric pressure ceases to constrain the width of the trail
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Ghost
climber
A long way from where I started
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Nov 10, 2010 - 03:29pm PT
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To read the article you have to be a paying member.
So, since none of us is a paying member, pointing to the article doesn't do much. Can you copy and paste? Or do a clear summary?
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