Search
Go

Discussion Topic

Return to Forum List
This thread has been locked
Messages 7741 - 7760 of total 9765 in this topic << First  |  < Previous  |  Show All  |  Next >  |  Last >>
apogee

climber
Sep 8, 2011 - 12:15am PT
Gary

climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
Sep 8, 2011 - 12:19am PT
What's funny, Donald, is that the very people you support have been selling us out to communist China. Ironic, isn't it?

"The Capitalists will sell us the rope with which we will hang them."
Gary

climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
Sep 8, 2011 - 12:22am PT
If it were not for the US you Canucks would be flying the hammer and sickle.

You got that backwards, too, Donald. If it wasn't for the hammer and sickle, Canada would be flying the swastika.

Have you considered taking a world history class at your local community college?
Mighty Hiker

climber
Vancouver, B.C.
Sep 8, 2011 - 12:26am PT
LEB, there is much to admire about the US, a very great deal in fact. That doesn't mean that the US is always right, or is above criticism. American exceptionalism being what it is, it may disturb you that other countries consciously choose different models of liberal democracy, and that it works well - for them. And the decline in US economic and (soon) military power may be hard for that country to stomach.

The US has been building an empire since long before Canada was a country. Reference the Monroe Doctrine, for starters. No one says you have to have an empire, or pay for it.

Canadians do find it offensive to be patronized by Americans, or taken for granted - both common errors by your politicians and diplomats. Our economies, peoples and cultures are interlinked, but we're not your little brother, and there are significant differences. You're a better neighbour than many I can think of, but can be clumsy.

The notion that Canada might every have been taken over by fascists or communists is utterly absurd. Neither has ever been more than a fringe group here.

I can be much more critical of Canada and our politicians, but doubt that many here would be much interested in the subject.
Jorroh

climber
Sep 8, 2011 - 12:29am PT
It continues to amaze me how willingly Republicans just ignore/misinterpret/misrepresent basic well established facts. One of that Confederacy of Dunces in Simi Valley has a chance to be the leader of this country. I guess when your supporters are people like LEB, Skipt DT etc you just have to puff out your chest and project the appropriate amount of bombast and righteous indignation, and they wont notice the complete nonsensical drivel that you're spouting.
rottingjohnny

Sport climber
mammoth lakes ca
Sep 8, 2011 - 12:41am PT
LEB..Your nuts...All Americans HATE SNOWBACKS...
John Moosie

climber
Beautiful California
Sep 8, 2011 - 12:44am PT
Neither do I hear people patronizing them, either.

Naw.. no one here has ever sneered at their healthcare system.
Gary

climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
Sep 8, 2011 - 12:44am PT
I don't support the the Chinese owning 9 % of our debt. This situation was not brought about by conservatives. It order to pay for the massive federal spending and growth of guvmint the left has intentionally brought about this outcome.

That's why Wall Street has moved our industrial base to China? Federal debt?
Mighty Hiker

climber
Vancouver, B.C.
Sep 8, 2011 - 12:48am PT
Oh, really?
American officials in Washington and Ottawa were counting down the days before former prime minister Jean Chretien left office, according to diplomatic cables. The cables, posted on the website WikiLeaks, outline the well-known coolness in relations between Chretien and George W. Bush's administration, but highlight how much the Americans couldn't wait for his successor, Paul Martin, to take power.

Diplomatic cables from the U.S. Embassy in Ottawa warned U.S. State Department officials in Washington that Chretien's lame-duck status as prime minister was the likely reason for his "bizarre anti-American public musings" designed to create a public relations problem for those Liberals who wanted him to leave politics before the end of 2003.

"In this regard, we should not underestimate Chretien's capacity to manipulate the system if it serves his purpose," reads the June 2003 cable, signed by then-U.S. ambassador Paul Cellucci. "At the same time, at least there is a light at the end of the tunnel."

The cable was written shortly after the Liberals launched a leadership race to replace Chretien, which the embassy labelled "Canada's race for a political cure."

The cables said that Martin likely would be a more favourable friend to the United States than Chretien.

"We believe that once Chretien is gone, there will be an improvement in Canada's policy toward the U.S., at least in tone and perhaps even substantively," reads a March 2003 cable titled "Canada-Iraq: What now?" and signed by Cellucci.

Much of the animosity was over the war in Iraq. Chretien kept Canada out of the war, much to the dismay of the Americans.

That dismay was the reason Bush postponed a state visit in 2003, according to an April 2003 cable. The postponement, the cable said, was "a harsh but necessary reality check for Canada."

The cables are a small portion of thousands of messages that provide an insider's view of American thinking on border security, anti-terrorism activities, the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, and Canada-U.S. relations.

One confidential cable, sent in November 2001 from the U.S. Embassy at the Vatican, details a diplomatic dinner where then-assistant deputy Canadian foreign minister Paul Dubois talked about how Bush, in a post-Sept. 11, 2001 speech to Congress, neglected to mention Canada's help in the days after 9/11.

"Dubois stressed that Canada is fully behind U.S. efforts to destroy terrorism, but did want to make the point that failing to mention Canada as an important partner was an oversight which was viewed as a major slight," reads the cable.
Most Canadians strongly supported our country not becoming involved in your imperial war in Iraq, but generally supported our involvement in Afghanistan, however futile it may end up being. We weren't in the least offended when Bush didn't come to dinner - quite the opposite. But we were annoyed ten years ago when our immediate and wholehearted response to the events of 11/9/01 wasn't acknowledged at all by Bush.

http://www.vancouversun.com/news/Americans+couldn+wait+Chretien+quit+cable+says/5350079/story.html#ixzz1XKiF0EKh

AS for healthcare, well, we've thrashed that one to death. The hard facts are that Canada spends significantly less on health care, and that Canadians live significantly longer and in better health. Even if we sometimes have to wait a bit for non-critical treatment, no one ever goes without prompt and affordable medical care.
Mighty Hiker

climber
Vancouver, B.C.
Sep 8, 2011 - 12:51am PT
Yup, they're squandering their inheritance for a mess of pottage. Pretty sad business.

And rj, that's frostback to you. Mister Frostback.
apogee

climber
Sep 8, 2011 - 12:57am PT
DT, you really are the tub_girl of ST polititards.
Mighty Hiker

climber
Vancouver, B.C.
Sep 8, 2011 - 01:02am PT
OK, support may have been too strong a word - maybe "saw as a sad duty", or something like that? Given that NATO decided to try to make a difference in Afghanistan, we were living up to our responsibilities, and trying to help, even though it was never clear it would make a lasting difference in that sorry place.
John Moosie

climber
Beautiful California
Sep 8, 2011 - 01:04am PT
even though it was never clear it would make a lasting difference in that sorry place.

the Russian leadership is laughing its collective ass off at us.
John Moosie

climber
Beautiful California
Sep 8, 2011 - 01:13am PT
No DT, unlike you, I don't laugh at others misfortune. It breaks my heart at our stupidity.
JEleazarian

Trad climber
Fresno CA
Sep 8, 2011 - 01:14am PT
Our political theater is all about entertainment.

Absolutely. The online poll on MSN is "who won the Republican debate?" Wouldn't it matter more whose ideas won? For that matter, why is electioneering 14 months before the election news at all?

Our analysis of current affairs ends at who won which poll. That only matters on election day. Unfortunately, the old saw that no one ever went broke underestimating the intelligence of the American people holds true so clearly in entertainment (and I include broadcast news here).

I am often harshly critical of the media, but I think we get the media we deserve. Other than the Wall Street Journal's news section, I read very little "news" that even attempts objectivity. At least the New York Times has depth in its coverage, even if a slant shows up now and then. Other than that, we tolerate a lot of "news" sources whose information I find at best useless.

Maybe the Wild West of information on the internet will eventually lead to reliable sources being generally recognized and available, but trying to gather objective information remains hard work right now, and I don't see that many people who care to put forth the effort. Easier to think and campaign in sound bites than in substance.

Sorry to be so negative, particularly when I offer no solution, but I find contemporary American journalism wallowing in a crisis of its own making, and unaware why it's floundering. Journalists have a tough job. We expect them to know everything, explain everything, and be paid next to nothing (for the most part). Maybe we're just getting what we pay for.

John
jstan

climber
Sep 8, 2011 - 01:29am PT
Maybe we're just getting what we pay for.

I have come to believe it is even worse than that. The form a government can take depends critically on the capabilities of the population.

Our people are no longer able to support our present form of government.

The US is in transition to something else, as we speak.

If you watch how people with power are behaving, you can see them positioning themselves for the change.


apogee

climber
Sep 8, 2011 - 01:40am PT
Impressions of the Sept. 7 Republican Debate

Santorum, Huntsman, Paul: Might as well give it up, boys. You're either too wacky, too rational, or too wacky for anyone to care.

Bachmann: Helmet-hair continues to prove that she speaks for the lunatic fringe. Ain't gonna happen, but she might help bring votes to the actual nominee.

Perry: Took a lot of pot-shots tonight. Lots of weirdness in his Texas past, but nothing that can't be overcome. He was heralded in the same way as Thompson/'08, with the difference being he's actually showing some mettle.

Gingrich: Personally, he came off with the strongest impression, for my money. Newt comes off in such a way that makes the rest of them look like wannabes- he's been there, done that. Unfortunately for him, he's waaaaay too undisciplined to make this happen. In the meantime, he's fun to watch, though.

Cain: Yawn.

Romney: Reasonably articulate, but he's Mormon. What a waste of campaign funds. If that wasn't enough, Romneycare is gonna sink his battleship.
JEleazarian

Trad climber
Fresno CA
Sep 8, 2011 - 01:47am PT
I have come to believe it is even worse than that. The form a government can take depends critically on the capabilities of the population. Our people are no longer able to support our present form of government.




I don't know about that, John. Many campaigns past would convince you that we were never able to support our present form of government. Cleveland-Blaine comes to mind, but there were many, many others. Maybe the Spoils System of the nineteenth century was just more honest than our current system.

Whenever I lost hope, though, I think back to the impact of Thomas Nast's cartoons in bringing down Willaim Tweed and Tammany Hall. "Boss" Tweed said he never worried about what the newspapers said, because the people that voted for him couldn't read, but they kept looking at "them damn pictures." I keep hoping that our current society will produce, in whatever medium, another Thomas Nast.

John
Mighty Hiker

climber
Vancouver, B.C.
Sep 8, 2011 - 02:07am PT
Admit it, LEB - you have a crush on Perry. And why are you up at 2:00 AM?
apogee

climber
Sep 8, 2011 - 02:09am PT
JE, what do you think about the current GOP offerings? Anybody catch your ear?
Messages 7741 - 7760 of total 9765 in this topic << First  |  < Previous  |  Show All  |  Next >  |  Last >>
Return to Forum List
 
Our Guidebooks
spacerCheck 'em out!
SuperTopo Guidebooks

guidebook icon
Try a free sample topo!

 
SuperTopo on the Web

Recent Route Beta