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Norton
Social climber
quitcherbellyachin
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Nov 19, 2014 - 08:16pm PT
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oh yeah, one more thing,,,,,
you know all those bills that the Republican House passed and sent over to Harry Reid in the Senate?
a majority of them had to do with defunding, voiding, the healthcare bill
you damn right Harry Reid was not going to do the Republican Party's job for them
get serious, get specific, know the details, prior to criticizing.....
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TGT
Social climber
So Cal
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Nov 19, 2014 - 08:18pm PT
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Norton loves tyrants.
MSNBC Host: I can’t find ‘a single Democrat in Washington’ to say if Obama’s amnesty plan is legal
By Ashley Dobson | November 18, 2014 | Comments
Image via Screenshot
Image via Screenshot
For once it’s not just Republicans questioning the legality of President Obama’s executive actions.
MSNBC host Lawrence O’Donnell discussed Obama’s upcoming executive action on immigration reform with Rep. Peter Welch (D – Vt.) and tried to find some sort of way to justify Obama’s promise of amnesty and work visas. Unfortunately for him, no such legal reasoning exists yet.
“No one at the White House has been able to give me the legal justification for the following component of the president’s plan,” O’Donnell said, going on to explain the specifics of it. “…What is the legal justification for the president to create a new category of beneficiaries for work documents? How can that be done without legislation?”
Welch not only said that he didn’t know, but that he didn’t care to know. But this is hardly surprising given the recent urging of Democrats for Obama to bypass Congress on this issue.
“Lawrence, I can’t tell you, and I’m not the lawyer who’s going to be litigating this case,” Welch said. “So the answer to that would be decided by the courts, as you and I know.”
O’Donnell didn’t let him get away with that answer and pushed again.
“I don’t mean to badger you about this, but I’ve been on this for days now,” O’Donnell said. “I haven’t found a single elected Democrat, not one Democrat in Washington who can answer the question that I just put to you. Have you heard it answered by any Democrats?”
“I haven’t. I haven’t,” Welch responded.
Watch the clip below:
Read more at http://redalertpolitics.com/2014/11/18/msnbc-host-cant-find-single-democrat-washington-say-obamas-amnesty-plan-legal/#d8lFP7TmrhESomZk.99
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crankster
Trad climber
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Nov 19, 2014 - 08:31pm PT
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Nov 19, 2014 - 08:00pm PT
They have presented us with another tyrant that pisses on the Constitution.
Fox News/Rightwing lunacy. Red Alert Politics?? Ha!! Now it's clear.
If the righties are upset you can be sure something good happened for the country (or is about to).
I think they're just upset they didn't get their ebola crisis.
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Larry Nelson
Social climber
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Nov 19, 2014 - 08:41pm PT
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Norton wrote:
you damn right Harry Reid was not going to do the Republican Party's job for them As well he shouldn't. He is an advocate for his democrat constituents.
Just as the right wingers are for their constituents. Just sayin.
Obviously I am not a policy wonk...I might even be one of those voters Professor Gruber (sp?) was talking about.
Judging by the hyperbole, straw man arguments, and ad hominems dropped on this thread, I figured an average intellect like mine could waltz in here and sound OK.
I see politics as religion minus the biblical ethical codes.
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Gary
Social climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
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Nov 19, 2014 - 08:43pm PT
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I don't remember folks that are not Repubcan or Democrats winning elections for offices that matter, in contested races in Idontno, now that it has a closed primary, or back when it had an open primary.
For that matter, I don't remember any independents winning national elections, although Ralph Nader running, certainly "screwed the pooch" for Al Gore in the 2000 presidential election.
Better to vote for what you want and not get it, than to vote for what you don't want and get it. Besides, Sanders is an Independent, for example.
Debs never won a presidential election, but he was getting so many votes, even after they threw him in prison for making a speech, that FDR was forced to adopt some of his proposals in the New Deal.
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crankster
Trad climber
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Nov 19, 2014 - 08:55pm PT
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Kinda like the 300 plus bills passed by the House that Harry Reid won't even allow a vote on in the Senate? Both parties, eh?
Larry, don't believe everything Hannity tells you. More fake outrage. Read.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/fact-checker/wp/2014/11/07/are-300-house-bills-really-bottled-up-in-the-senate/
In any event, Bump found that this Congress has introduced fewer bills than most past Congresses and put far fewer in front of the president to sign.
The Pinocchio Test
This is one of these “facts” that is sorely lacking context. While some 300 bills have passed the House and failed to pass the Senate, there is nothing unusual or unique about this. As Bump put it, “when it comes to House legislation that the Senate is ignoring, it’s the same as it ever was. Republicans earn Two Pinocchios for this claim.”
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Larry Nelson
Social climber
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Nov 19, 2014 - 09:09pm PT
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Crankster wrote:
Larry, don't believe everything Hannity tells you. Read. I have no TV feeds into my house, but I do watch Netflix sometimes.
dirtbag wrote:
It was killed by right wingers, who completely abdicated their responsibility to govern by refusing to even discuss the issue. So according to Crankster's link, it wasn't killed by right wingers, it was just business as usual?
I will remain a bemused observer.
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rick sumner
Trad climber
reno, nevada/ wasilla alaska
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Nov 19, 2014 - 09:13pm PT
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Kiss their rings Werner?
The knee pads they are wearing indicate they're way past that.
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dirtbag
climber
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Topic Author's Reply - Nov 19, 2014 - 10:30pm PT
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No Larry, you are not an observer. Again, as Norton said, and as I said, immigration reform died in the Republican controlled house, without discussion. It is simply not true that both parties are responsible.
If you didn't "observe" that last year then you were asleep.
If you choose not to learn about it then you are ignorant.
In this case, at least, your "both parties do it" mantra is, to be blunt, simplistic, untrue, ignorant horsesh#t. Get educated.
Edit: you actually sound a lot like Lois.
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Larry Nelson
Social climber
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Nov 20, 2014 - 05:08am PT
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dirtbag wrote: Edit: you actually sound a lot like Lois.
Unfamiliar with Lois, but judging by your pseudonym, she probably dresses better than both of us.
Edit: because current immigration laws are not enforced, I blame both parties.
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Gary
Social climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
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Nov 20, 2014 - 05:41am PT
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Republicans support NSA spying on citizens:
WASHINGTON--Legislation to keep most Americans' phone records out of government hands was defeated in the Senate on Tuesday, dooming at least for now prospects of national security reforms that supporters said would protect the privacy of law-abiding citizens.
A motion failed to get the necessary 60 votes needed to cut off debate on the bill sponsored by Sen. Patrick Leahy (D-Vt.), with most Republicans voting against. The final vote was 58 in favor to 42 against.
One of its most outspoken foes was incoming Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-Ky.), who said stopping the National Security Agency from collecting telephone dialing records "would end one of our nation's critical capabilities to gather significant intelligence on terrorist threats."
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Gary
Social climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
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Nov 20, 2014 - 06:48am PT
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I think most national level elections are effectively rigged. Choice A vs Choice B has been vetted by big business, big politics, big military and big money. Our votes are not much different than a once-candidate communist party vote. A show, an expensive show, and mostly pretense at democracy that no longer truly exists.
We don't have politics, we have elections.
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Gary
Social climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
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Nov 20, 2014 - 07:11am PT
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Kos, the differences are minor. The differences are over tactics, not strategy. It's all about politics.
The Republicans were all for Romneycare, after all they designed it. Then it became Obamacare so they had to come out against it.
During the election that put Raygun in power the Republicans bashed the Democrats for running deficits. The Democrats said deficits were good.
The Raygun blew deficits through the roof and suddenly the Republicans said deficits didn't matter and Democrats said deficits were bad.
Is net neutrality a major issue? We never talk about the big issues. Just as Sanders stated:
“The biggest issue in the country is that we don't discuss the biggest issue in the country,” Sanders told me in his Senate office last week.
“How does it happen that today the economists tell us that 95% of all new income created in America goes to the top 1%? How does it happen that we have by far the most unequal distribution of wealth and income of any major country on Earth, where one family, the Walton family of Wal-Mart, owns more wealth than the bottom 40% of the American people? How does that happen, and what do we do about it?”
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Jingy
climber
Somewhere out there
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Nov 20, 2014 - 08:13am PT
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[Click to View YouTube Video]
I think the republicans got hard over this guy, tossed their loads, and have been in a P.O.D. of decision making ever since.
I know that Ron Reagan's compassion was completely fake, what with Ronnie being a classically trained actor and all, but much like anyone in this life... they have their moments when they are completely believable.
kos edit
Funny how nobody wants to talk about Net Neutrality, on the internet.
I much prefer the idea of getting facts and call to my senator/congress personnel... I'm not convinced of either avenue being effective for changing anything about the power dynamic (I still have little to no power to effect anything...
Not to mention... where have you been looking to find nobody talking about net neutrality?
Its here too.. I mean its been discussed here....
http://www.funnyordie.com/videos/9873757f97/porn-star-net-neutrality
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Ken M
Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
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Nov 20, 2014 - 08:32am PT
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I just don't get the "illegal" label that the Repugs are trying to pin on this.
I see the Constitution as giving the President unlimited power to pardon, and I believe that there have been multiple court decisions upholding that. It is in black and white.
But if not,
Does that mean that Ford did something illegal when he conditionally gave amnesty to draft dodgers? Carter when he did it unconditionally? Should we arrest them all? (I say start with Dick Cheney!)
Does that mean that Obama is actually a slave, because Lincoln's Emancipation Proclamation was illegal?
Truman acted illegally when he eliminated segregation in the military?
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Ken M
Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
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Nov 20, 2014 - 08:47am PT
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After Ford left the White House in 1977, the former President privately justified his pardon of Nixon by carrying in his wallet a portion of the text of Burdick v. United States, a 1915 U.S. Supreme Court decision which stated that a pardon indicated a presumption of guilt, and that acceptance of a pardon was tantamount to a confession of that guilt.[67]
In 2001, the John F. Kennedy Library Foundation awarded the John F. Kennedy Profile in Courage Award to Ford for his pardon of Nixon.[68] In presenting the award to Ford, Senator Ted Kennedy said that he had initially been opposed to the pardon of Nixon, but later stated that history had proved Ford to have made the correct decision
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Jingy
climber
Somewhere out there
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Nov 20, 2014 - 08:47am PT
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Does that mean that Ford did something illegal when he conditionally gave amnesty to draft dodgers? Carter when he did it unconditionally? Should we arrest them all? (I say start with Dick Cheney!)
Does that mean that Obama is actually a slave, because Lincoln's Emancipation Proclamation was illegal?
Truman acted illegally when he eliminated segregation in the military?
Yes, Ken M.
If their only concern is to paint a picture of their opponent as negative, then this is what they would do. It never matters what it is, it never matters what happened yesterday, it doesn't matter what they wrote, or said or did... long as the negative stays on the opponent... the world is good for the repub jive
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Jingy
climber
Somewhere out there
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Nov 20, 2014 - 09:13am PT
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Not only are the repubs complete hypocritical on the immigration issues...
But when I review their party platform from the last presidential election era... and I lay out what the republican ideas were, as they were spelled out by themselves, and hold they overlay over what they have done over the last 6 years... I'm appalled that anyone would ever consider themselves a card carrying member of the republican party...
just seems disingenuous to me.
(opps Edit)
http://www.presidency.ucsb.edu/ws/index.php?pid=101961
Looking at the boldly worded headlines on this page and ask yourself what any republican has done toward this goal...
2012 Republican Party Platform
August 27, 2012
Campaign 2012
The American Presidency Project
Promote Your Page Too
We Believe in America: 2012 REPUBLICAN PLATFORM
This platform is dedicated with appreciation and reverence for:
The wisdom of the Framers
of the United States Constitution,
who gave us a Republic,
as Benjamin Franklin cautioned,
if we can keep it.
[Paid for by the Committee on Arrangements for the 2012 Republican National Convention Not Authorized By Any Candidate Or Candidate's Committee www.gopconvention2012.com]
American Exceptionalism
Restoring the American Dream: Rebuilding the Economy and Creating Jobs
Job Creation: Getting Americans Back to Work - Have repubs done anything toward this end?
Small Business and Entrepreneurship
Tax Relief to Grow the Economy and Create Jobs
American Competitiveness in a Global Economy - how have they improved your competitiveness today?
Fundamental Tax Principles - about the only thing repubs can focus on... for the rich... not for me.
Reining in Out-of-Control Spending, Balancing the Budget, and Ensuring Sound Monetary Policy - has a republican balanced a budget.
Balancing the Budget - look at that... they repeat it... but what have they done towards this end?
Inflation and the Federal Reserve - have you repubs heard anything on this lately?
Ending the Housing Crisis and Expanding Opportunities for Homeownership - haven't the repubs led the charge on kicking people out of their homes with their economic decisions and constant drum-beat of "law and order" and continue to choose profit over people every day.
Rebuilding Homeownership - have the repubs done anything towards this end?
Infrastructure: Building the Future - I haven't checked, what have they re-built again?
A Twenty-First Century Workforce - except that they have been on a 30 war on education... and they are winning fr the most part...
Freedom in the Workplace - this feels more like freedom from the workplace with all the layoffs since the 80's.
Defending Marriage Against An Activist Judiciary - ah, doesn't this sort of count as a huge loss at this point? Hasn't the republican party really failed to keep marriage between men and women only? Well, doesn't that clearly show that they have failed and that we should get rid of them for this fundamental failure.
A Sacred Contract: Defense of Marriage - failed.
Living Within Our Means: A Constitutional Budget - again, I haven't heard anything from the repugs on the budget. While at the same time they continue to push for more guns, more wars, more enforcement of the willy-nilly
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Larry Nelson
Social climber
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Nov 20, 2014 - 09:15am PT
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Dirtbag, Norton, Crankster,
Here is a link that supports my contention that the whole political class in Washington DC is rotten to the core. 60 Minutes did a segment on this book a few years ago. Your religious leaders in the democrat party may even be worse than the leaders in the republican party. Be careful about preaching sermons on behalf of the unethical priests in DC.
The full story of the inside game in Washington shows how the permanent political class enriches itself at the expense of the rest of us. Insider trading is illegal on Wall Street, yet it is routine among members of Congress. Normal individuals cannot get in on IPOs at the asking price, but politicians do so routinely. The Obama administration has been able to funnel hundreds of millions of dollars to its supporters, ensuring yet more campaign donations. An entire class of investors now makes all of its profits based on influence and access in Washington.
http://www.amazon.com/Throw-Them-All-Out-Politicians/dp/0547573146
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Larry Nelson
Social climber
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Nov 20, 2014 - 10:09am PT
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This is a fictional story a friend emailed, I don't know who originated it, but I thought all would appreciate the humor.
Canadians: “Build a Damn Fence!”
From The Manitoba Herald , Canada ; “Reported” by Clive Runnels
The flood of American liberals sneaking across the border into Canada has intensified in the past week, sparking calls for increased patrols to stop the illegal immigration. The recent actions of the Tea Party, and the fact Republicans won the Senate, are prompting an exodus among left-leaning citizens who fear they’ll soon be required to hunt, pray, and agree with Bill O’Reilly and Glenn Beck.
Canadian border farmers say it’s not uncommon to see dozens of sociology professors, animalrights activists, and Unitarians crossing their fields at night.
“I went out to milk the cows the other day, and there was a Hollywood producer huddled in the barn,” said Southern Manitoba farmer Red Greenfield, whose acreage borders North Dakota. The producer was cold, exhausted, and hungry. He asked me if I could spare a latte and some free-range chicken. When I said I didn’t have any, he left before I even got a chance to show him my screenplay, eh?”
In an effort to stop the illegal aliens, Greenfield erected higher fences, but the liberals scaled them. He then installed loudspeakers that blared Rush Limbaugh across the fields. “Not real effective,” he said. “The liberals still got through, and Rush annoyed the cows so much that they wouldn’t give any milk.”
Officials are particularly concerned about smugglers who meet liberals near the Canadian border, pack them into Volvo station wagons, and drive them across the border, where they are simply left to fend for themselves. “A lot of these people are not prepared for our rugged conditions,” an Ontario border patrolman said. “I found one carload without a single bottle of imported drinking water. They did have a nice little Napa Valley cabernet, though.” When liberals are caught, they’re sent back across the border, often wailing loudly that they fear retribution from conservatives. Rumors have been circulating about plans being made to build re-education camps where liberals will be forced to drink domestic beer and watch NASCAR races.
In recent days, liberals have turned to ingenious ways of crossing the border. Some have been disguised as senior citizens taking a bus trip to buy cheap Canadian prescription drugs. After catching half-a-dozen young vegans in powdered wig disguises, Canadian immigration authorities began stopping buses and quizzing the supposed seniorcitizens about Perry Como and Rosemary Clooney to prove that they were alive in the ’50s. “If they can’t identify the accordion player on The Lawrence Welk Show, we become very suspicious about their age,” an official said.
Canadian citizens have complained that the illegal immigrants are creating an organicbroccoli shortage and are renting all the Michael Moore movies. “I really feel sorry for American liberals, but the Canadian economy just can’t support them,” an Ottawa resident said. “How many arthistory majors does one country need?”
In an effort to ease tensions between the United States and Canada, Vice President Biden met with the Canadian ambassador and pledged that the administration would take steps to reassure liberals. A source close to President Obama said, “We’re going to have some Paul McCartney and Peter, Paul & Mary concerts. And we might even put some endangered species on postage stamps. The President is determined to reach out,” he said.
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