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Norton
Social climber
the Wastelands
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The real winners of the healthcare bill are threefold.
One: The Private Health Insurance Companies, they get millions more profit centers (people).
Two: The Drug companies. Duh.
Why? Because tens of millions of MORE Americans will be insured.
Three: The tens of millions who will be insured, that are NOT insured now.
The losers: The healthy (for now) who will HAVE to buy insurance (or pay a penalty when they do their income taxes), and do not (for now) get more benefits than they pay in while they remain healthy.
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Norton
Social climber
the Wastelands
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And here is one Fatty's Repubs would like!
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bvb
Social climber
flagstaff arizona
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oh, bump this rig! there's so much left unsaid! so many minds yet to change!
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bvb
Social climber
flagstaff arizona
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You are SO obsessed with your father using too much resources. I don't know why you are so worried. Worry more about your own life
yeah fat. fuk yer dad. who gives adammaboutim?
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EdBannister
Mountain climber
CA
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I had lunch today with one of the world's best spine surgeons. He is on national and international boards, and is the former department head of spine surgery at Loma Linda.... he knows his stuff. quotes:
"I don't know a doctor over 60 who is not considering ceasing to practice."
and,
"they don't understand that they may be insured, but they won't have access."
meaning, with perhaps 10% of all doctors retired, and the ones that are left, left with more paperwork,
there will less time, a huge amount less time, for patients.
access will drop but 15 % or more,
even the drop out rate at medical schools is going up right now, fewer people willing to go through it for a future determined by the fed.
less doctors on the way too.
just think how the post office is, that is your healthcare future with Obamacare.
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Jaybro
Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
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"My motto in life, hope for the best - plan for the worse. "
Well, my sister and i agree on, something, though I would say worst, instead of worse. As long as she votes, I gotta!
Which one was interview 2 , Lois? My dyselexia (that the republicant's won't fix) gets me mixed up on these issues. In any case, good luck with this, whether it's with the dying, or those who need help to live.
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Norton
Social climber
the Wastelands
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things are great right now, we don't need no healthcare reform
It's all the fault of that big government.
All politicians are paid crooks.
I watch TV, I don't need to read the bill myself.
The bill is too heavy, too many pages, and words, and stuff.
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happiegrrrl
Trad climber
New York, NY
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I can see old docs(60+) nit wanting to deal with what would probably be an irritating set of changes.
But I'd be interested to see actual stats of med school drop out rate increases(compared over several years, perhaps decades).
I also do no think that there will be difficulty in finding people who want to become doctors. If there is a shortage, then there will be incentives created for people to work in the field.
And lets not forget that not everyone goes into medicine because they are looking to make big money. There are people who actually feel a calling to heal, just as there are those called to ministry, the arts, and any number of trades and practices. There may actually be more access to those who had the calling but not the cash(to finance med school). Our doctors may, some day, be able to actually practice medicine again.
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corniss chopper
Mountain climber
san jose, ca
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Raise your hand if you appointed yourself to look after me.
(Send all your cash as I can spend it better than you can, Really.)
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Jaybro
Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
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Good luck! You will kick ass ™ !!!111 in either, or any other, opportunity!
we'll still argue, though......
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Norton
Social climber
the Wastelands
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Corniss, I am convinced you are the smartest sob ever to post on Taco.
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TGT
Social climber
So Cal
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I had lunch today with one of the world's best spine surgeons. He is on national and international boards, and is the former department head of spine surgery at Loma Linda.... he knows his stuff. quotes:
"I don't know a doctor over 60 who is not considering ceasing to practice."
and,
"they don't understand that they may be insured, but they won't have access."
meaning, with perhaps 10% of all doctors retired, and the ones that are left, left with more paperwork,
there will less time, a huge amount less time, for patients.
access will drop but 15 % or more,
even the drop out rate at medical schools is going up right now, fewer people willing to go through it for a future determined by the fed.
less doctors on the way too.
just think how the post office is, that is your healthcare future with Obamacare.
Reality is just so inconvenient!
Maybe they need to outlaw that too.
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bvb
Social climber
flagstaff arizona
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just think how the post office is, that is your healthcare future with Obamacare
this may be neither here nor there, but i sorta like the u.s. postal service. always been a good value for me.
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bvb
Social climber
flagstaff arizona
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In fact, neurosurgery is a very competitive residency
"hey....doctor!"
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michae1
Gym climber
san jose
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the post office is ok, at best , how ever i do seem to remember that it is in constant need of money
and its rates continue to rise, at the same time it is losing business to the private sector
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Karl Baba
Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
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Leb keeps posting up the real story for once!
You guys worrying about not being able to find people willing to go to medical school and then fill some of these elite residencies programs is like someone worrying about wanting to watch movies in the future and then fearing that there will be no supply of wanna be actors and actresses to fill the spots. Neurosurgery is elite. Orthopedics is elite. Ophthalmology is elite and arguable the elitist of the elite. I could go on but you get the picture. Many, many want these slots desperately and very few get them. People literally foam at the mouth for some of these residencies programs. They settle for other fields of medicine because the competition is so tough for the top tier.
Same thing with even getting into medical school in the first place. It is not like there are spots going begging. Once again, it is like sitting around worrying that no young men are going to want to play college football for say Notre Dame and thus you are not going to get to watch any college bowl games. It is equivalent to worrying that spots are going to be open and no college age men are going to be interested in playing so therefore no one is going to get to go to a Notre Dame football game in the future. It is not going to happen. There is going to be way more guys who wish they could make the team then actually will do so.
So true. Want to reduce medical costs and have more access. Subsidize more medical schools and let more people in the programs. Probably WAY cheaper than many of the alternatives thrown out there. This game is kept small for the profit and high prices of the profession. We commonly have to wait weeks for an appointment in the US. In others countries, you can often just walk in and get seen by a doc
Peace
Karl
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Karl Baba
Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
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It is like someone wishes to open a cafeteria in the center of town where working class people can go and fatty is screaming because he does not want to eat there. Rather he wishes to continue to patronize this five-star restaurant where he has always taken his family. WTF. Nobody is telling fatty in can't continue to dine where ever he wants. We simply want to open up more choices to more people.
It's more like he's afraid that someone, at some time, might increase his taxes somewhat to subsidize a soup kitchen for the poor.
Of course, the tax increase wouldn't put any dent in his lifestyle. It's a knee-jerk selfish reaction based on turning real people into theoretical ideas that don't suffer and bleed. Fatty would offer you the shirt off his back in person but push a button to kill thousands of young Iranians from a distance.
Peace
Karl
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Norton
Social climber
the Wastelands
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Let's talk about the "unfunded liabilities" of SS and Medicare:
Watch Fatty sell "socialism", watch him sell FEAR and IGNORANCE
Fatty's "The Sky Is Falling": NOT
The notion of "unfunded liabilities" in certain programs is based on the arbitrary assumption that certain designated revenue sources should pay for certain classes of government expenditures. The story that Social Security and Medicare should be paid for out of payroll taxes and their trust funds is not a recent creation of critics of those systems. It has been around for decades. But why? Revenues and expenditures are "fungible," meaning that a dollar is a dollar is a dollar. In fact, today's Social Security surplus flows right into the pot with other revenues, while a significant portion of Medicare costs already are paid for out of general revenue. The real question is not "will the designated revenues be enough to pay for the designated programs" but "will we have enough income to afford to keep the promises we have made?"
There is no question that the nation's gross domestic product will be sufficient to meet all of our Social Security promises forever, leaving lots of income for increasing the prosperity of the young. In general, the outlook for economic growth is good. Our average income per person in 100 years is likely to be much, much higher than it is today (more than four times as high). Social Security benefits are predicted to rise from about 4.5 percent of our GDP to about 6.6 percent over the next century. Even though such long predictions are very uncertain, this one should leave us sanguine: if incomes in 100 years are only twice their present level, and incomes of the old rise from 4.5 to 6.6 percent of income, that still leaves us with $1.96 for every dollar we have today, after Social Security obligations are taken care of. We can continue to keep our modest Social Security promises, and young families still will be much better off than families are today.
There also is no question that, if health care costs continue to rise as rapidly into the indefinite future as they have in recent years, medical expenditures will soak up a much, much larger share of our overall income than they do now, leaving a smaller and smaller share for other uses. Unlike Social Security, this could indeed become a grave problem.
What's Generational Accounting Got to Do With It?
Although the notion that we are headed for a fiscal train wreck is stated in the language of scientific prediction, there is a moral element as well. Building on the idea of "generational accounting," those who foresee a catastrophe are implicitly using the ethical standard that people should take care of themselves over their lifetimes-not rely on government transfers from others (including from other generations). The idea is that it is unfair for old people as a group to get back more than they paid into the public trough (using appropriate interest rates).
This is a very odd notion. Why is it that young people in general will be better off than their parents? Fundamentally, it is because of the information and technology that earlier generations produced, the engine of modern economic growth. If the older generation levied fees on all the intellectual property they created, that could amount to an enormous claim by older people on their children: "We invented the transistor and financial derivatives, which is what makes you so productive. Pay up."
There is no need to charge rent on the intellectual property the young inherit from earlier generations. Instead, we can use our common sense. If the old are a growing proportion of the population, and the pie we all have to share is much bigger than it was, we should give a larger slice to the elderly.
Don't Worry, Be Happy
Imagine if in 1950, someone had calculated the costs of educating the baby boomers in public institutions through their college years. What an immense, unmanageable burden! And nothing-not a penny-had been set aside by 1950 to cover the costs of public universities in the 1960s and 1970s! Using the logic of unfunded liabilities that has fueled alarmist media stories, public universities should have been closed; education should have been left to the private sector.
Yet nobody ever claimed in the 1950s and 1960s that the education of the Baby Boomers was an excessive burden our society, or that our public institutions could not afford to accept the challenge. When we needed more schools, we built them. Why should the Boomers' retirement be unmanageable? We need to strengthen social insurance for old people, and we will be able to afford it.
http://www.socsec.org/publications.asp?pubid=496
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bvb
Social climber
flagstaff arizona
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Again, I keep saying this over and over.
we've noticed!~
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Karl Baba
Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
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Actually, Karl, technically speaking, the soup kitchen is serving fatty's needs, only he might not realize it. If the people were starving to death, they would be more likely to raid fatty's home in search of food. When you live in a society you are living in a community of people and you just can't ignore a whole segment of them. What happens to one part of the population ultimately effects everyone.
They are going to drum you right out of the Republican party at this rate Lois! Welcome to the Democratic Party Lois...the back news is...It sucks too, it's just a theoretically less bloodly and sucking form of sucking.
It's true, there are a lot more poor and middle class people than rich ones. The money needs to keep the masses from getting too restless or democracy will have to be sacrificed to keep the rich rich.
Of course, it's still blasphemy to think we don't need to speed 45% of the World's total military expenditures on our own "Defense" What a joke. There's plenty of money to do the right thing but the military industrial complex might have to lay off somebody. Don't you think we could keep the invaders at bay with a little less?
Peace
Karl
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