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Contractor
Boulder climber
CA
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Mar 25, 2016 - 03:43pm PT
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Escopeta- ?
Norton- Agree but it pissed me off! Messy triage, political solutions had to be done.
There's been a huge surge of conservative 501c's (phony nonprofits). They are disproportionately spun from cooperations and their teams of tax attorneys. They act as political attack dogs to advance their agenda and are clearly breaking the rules of their bullsh#t, tax exempt status. It's called "Dark Money" for a reason.
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Norton
Social climber
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Mar 25, 2016 - 04:07pm PT
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Norton: spot on, but I will add that to his credit, President Bush realized that massive government intervention was needed to avert a catastrophe. At least he was flexible at that critical moment.
Dirtbag, you are talking about President Bush signing the first TARP legislation that congress passed I assume?
if so then yes, it was the right thing to do, also I believe that he left bailing out the US automakers and savings millions of jobs to the incoming President Obama
my point, or criticism of President Bush, is that the financial crises occurred not only on his watch but also when he could have done something possibly hugely effective about it, in large part i feel because he was distracted from domestic issues do to his
focus on waging his own invasion and Nation Building massive blunder in iraq
I guess I have trouble congratulating someone for trying to fix something that he himself was very responsible for creating in the first place....
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Jorroh
climber
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Mar 25, 2016 - 04:25pm PT
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I think it's important to point out that the Clinton Administration played its own part.
The best you can say is that they did little or nothing to change the trajectory of economic policy and philosophy that had begun during the Reagan years.
The worst, that they pushed forward that trajectory with gusto. And when you really distill all the contributing factors right down, its market fundamentalism that was the root of the mortgage meltdown.
Clintons economic team was fully market fundamentalist (the worst sort actually...wall street market fundamentalist) and it bothers me that some democrats still can't acknowledge that.
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dirtbag
climber
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Mar 25, 2016 - 04:36pm PT
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I agree, Norton!
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High Fructose Corn Spirit
Gym climber
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Mar 26, 2016 - 07:21am PT
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A few liberals here come to mind: Norton, Crankster, Dr. F., Nature.
Can you guys say it? "radical Islamic terrorism"? (EDIT: Or is it "giving in"? See below.)
FOX news doesn't own the term.
They do NOT OWN the term. (Nor did they invent it.) When liberals cede this term to Trump and gang, or to Cruz and gang, or to O'Reilly-Hannity, they only empower them and their politics. Please wake up LIBERALS and get in the game on this issue.
So lets hear it... radical Islamic terrorism... radical Islamic terrorism... radical Islamic terrorism.
Half the solution to a problem is correctly identifying the problem. Corollary: Half the solution to a problem is correctly NAMING the problem.
Bears repeating...
[Click to View YouTube Video]
Would love to hear from liberals here (other than climbski2) who disagree either with Bill Maher or me regarding this term.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bLIbDaqPXG8
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Craig Fry
Trad climber
So Cal.
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Mar 26, 2016 - 07:39am PT
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I say it all the time
"radical Islamic terrorism"
But I'm far from PC
and I'm not in the Presidential admin
they don't say it for one reason
They don't want to enflame racial division
They need to be PC
Billions of people react to what they say
and to react to them not saying it is SOoooooooo petty
that us liberals think it's not worth disccusing
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High Fructose Corn Spirit
Gym climber
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Mar 26, 2016 - 07:42am PT
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Thank you. Craig.
Yes, I understand why a Dem politician, esp any caught up in this crazy partisan stew, is shy about the term. Then again, probably what, 99 per cent of liberals or leftists or Democrats are NOT politicians? They need to get with it, raise their game, imo, and NAME that CORE COMPONENT in the problem complex... radical Islamic terrorism.
I have no problem distinguishing between Islam and "radical Islamic terrorism."
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Craig Fry
Trad climber
So Cal.
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Mar 26, 2016 - 07:50am PT
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I really don't care,
and I think it will have no influence on the elections
I think terrorism is a very small problem for our Country
We overreact way too much, even when it happens 1000s of miles away,
all the little cowards go nuts and think we need to lock down the Country
What kind of BS is that?
I worry more about the right wing policies being implemented
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crankster
Trad climber
No. Tahoe
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Mar 26, 2016 - 07:53am PT
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I'll give it a go...
First, recognize that, whatever you call it, we currently have a military and intelligence strategy to try to defeat ISIS and others. The President and the Joint Chiefs aren't sitting on their hands. Obviously, we are reluctant to send in U.S. ground forces in large numbers. Those reasons (Iraq) should be obvious. Ok, maybe not to Republican presidential candidates who are eager to exploit any successful terrorist attack for political advantage. Defeating a cowardly enemy that hides among the civilian population isn't easy. Anyone that tells you it is is lying.
As for the term...I get Maher's point...to a point. The presidents's rationale is correct; we need Muslim countries on our side and anything that suggests the U.S. is at war with a religion is counterproductive. Disarming a GOP talking point is secondary. Everyone knows the only reason they do it is to call in the question the legitimacy of the president, constant dog whistling his religion and birthplace.
So, give in to them and start using the term "radical Islamic terrorism"? No. First, that wouldn't change anything. You think everyone would make nice? Nope. Maher's wrong. He should take tango lessons.
Hillary uses the term "radical jihadists". Good enough for me, as is her strategy to defeat them.
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High Fructose Corn Spirit
Gym climber
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Mar 26, 2016 - 07:54am PT
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I really don't care, and I think it will have no influence on the elections
Well, I'm squarely in Maher's camp on this one.
If weeks before the election, there is a radical Islamic terrorist event here in the states... a so-called 9/12... it could very well end up... President Trump.
In such a case, was "radical Islamic terrorism" really such a minor component in the mix? in the politics? and really nbd?
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High Fructose Corn Spirit
Gym climber
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Mar 26, 2016 - 08:01am PT
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So, give in to them and start using the term "radical Islamic terrorism"?
You sound like hddj, as if the Republican Party invented the term. Talk about ceding power.
I've used the term for 15 plus years, probably even before the 9/11 attack. What's it going to take? another one in the ports of LA, a nuclear one, before the nomenclature and conversation and problem solving transcend partisan politics. Sheeesh.
The rest of your post, I agree with.
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Craig Fry
Trad climber
So Cal.
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Mar 26, 2016 - 08:02am PT
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Do you really think if the President used the term like you want that it change anything?
Get real
Everything he does is bad, these people will always find fault no matter what he does
even if he killed off everyone one of "radical Islamic Terrorists", a terrorist attack could still happen.
and everything Reagan did was good, and they will go to their graves being right wing apologists
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High Fructose Corn Spirit
Gym climber
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Mar 26, 2016 - 08:04am PT
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"Do you really think if the President used the term like you want that it change anything?"
I am not saying the President. Sheesh.
The President is doing and saying just as he should.
Suggest watching the rest of last night's show. Maher's guest, Ian Bremmer, imo, states the case just right.
In the campaign, the liberal Democratic side could emasculate the right on this particular issue by not ceding the term and plainly distinguishing between Islam (religion) and radical Islamic extremism (violence/terrorism). Yes, I do think most folks, those on the lib left side especially, have gained a point in their development would they could understand this.
.....
you can't make me say those PC words of yours...
That's hilarious.
"radical Islamic extremism"
Now they are PC? I thought they were not PC? Now they are PC?
Hahaha, maybe we could all agree they are pc-related. lol
.....
Hillary uses the term "radical jihadists".
Only started recently, I think. PROGRESS.
Well it's a start.
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Craig Fry
Trad climber
So Cal.
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Mar 26, 2016 - 08:23am PT
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I think we need to use the words "radical Christian terrorist" every time a Christian kills more than one person
I just don't understand the hypocrisy of letting these Christians go around killing without labeling them for what they ARE!
They put millions to death for most of their early History, they were a church of terror, and they spawned off many terrorist groups like the KKK, the Nazis, the W. Bush Admin and so on,
luckily we became a more secular Nation and took away most of their authority.
But they still have terrorists that live today, killing people that they see as against Christian principles
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WBraun
climber
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Mar 26, 2016 - 08:34am PT
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The entire root radical Islamic terrorism was created by the western coalition as psyops to destabilize the Mideast for their criminal resources theft.
Simultaneously the western coalition uses the same psyops to maintain the high fear ratio onto the unsuspecting public to keep their very own military industrial complex going.
This provides economic development which drives the illusionary industrial nations economic base at the expense of the greater humanity.
The whole thing is a powerful criminal enterprise by criminals to humanity masqueraded as human advancement .......
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Larry Nelson
Social climber
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Mar 26, 2016 - 08:43am PT
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Welcome back Werner ;-)
Craig posted
They put millions to death for most of their early History, luckily we became a secular Nation and took away their authority.
But they still have terrorists that live today, killing people that they see as against Christian principles
Well, if you want to go tit for tat and back in history, how do we define the president's buddy Bill Ayers?
Where are Christians killing people now?
Crankster made some good points.
We have policies in place, we don't have the political capital to send a massive force into the region, and we need Muslim countries on our side.
The fix for Radical Islamic Terrorism is within the Muslim culture itself. We need to support the vast majority of good Muslims to cure the festering cancer of the jihadists.
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Norton
Social climber
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Mar 26, 2016 - 09:04am PT
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?
Neither myself nor any other "liberal" I know has any problem at all in saying "radical Islam"
Seriously i don't know of anyone who does not use that term to describe the basterds
Presidents and State Department Diplomats operate on a close personal level with Muslims and so they have to really watch what and how they say things, as Craig said
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WBraun
climber
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Mar 26, 2016 - 09:06am PT
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The fix for Radical Islamic Terrorism is within the Muslim culture itself.
Nope, it's within us ourselves since we created it thru rape of the planets resources to feed the illusinary high standard of living in the western industrialized nations.
All the terrorism is the exact karmic reaction to our own selfishness.
The American way ..... point the finger at someone else and take no responsibility.
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crankster
Trad climber
No. Tahoe
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Mar 26, 2016 - 09:06am PT
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When does anti-PC become so accepted it become PC?
Why worry about a term anyway? Time to come together against a common enemy. We know our differences, what do we have in common?
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