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Good Morning!
climber
Prescott, AZ
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Some thoughts:
Where will you keep your weapon? It has to be immediately available to be useful.
How will your weapon be immediately available if it is locked up and 'safe'?
Police officers train to be able to get that weapon on their side out fast. Yet once an assailiant is within about 12' feet of the officer it has been found that most officers cannot get their weapon out and trained before the assailant is on them. Think about that...
So you will need to have you defensive weapon readily available. No locks, no boxes, loaded and a round in the chamber. And you have kids. Is this really going to work?
I'd encourage you to look past the false security of firearms and consider other options: good locks, neighbourhood watch (particularly effective in rural settings like yours), and defensive tactics (fun for all the family!). Firearms certainly have their place; but your situation does not sound like one of them.
M. Ziebell
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Ben Rumsen
Social climber
No Name City ( and it sure ain't pretty )
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" I think, odds are, the risk is too great. But, risk can be mitigated especially through discipline and education. So, depends.
Also, if whatever you have is stored and locked away, and you have it for some type of percieved threat, then, how useful will it be if you need it quickly? " -
There are many types of easy to get into if you need it gun safes around. Unless you live in a " hair trigger / armed camp " situation, you usually have time to get a weapon - especially if you have a dog ( buys you time, and a early warning system all in one ). I usually depend on a gun when traveling / camping etc. anyway, not so much at home. Maybe I need to turn my home theater into a safe room ( " pass the 1911 - A1 .45 auto and the popcorn Honey - there's an intruder outside the theater door " )!!!
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Brian in SLC
Social climber
Salt Lake City, UT
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"the fact is, most homeowners that try to defend themselves with guns become the shooting VICTIM."
That is absolutely not true.
Where did you get that from?
I'd like to see the study that concluded anything like that.
What would cause that?
I wouldn't think it was "most". Seems like I've seen "9%" as a number from the Bureau of Crime Statistics or some such as the number of folks using a firearm to defend themselves that have it used on them. I'd bet the number is much higher for police officers.
Now, if you looked at how often is a homeowners gun used against someone besides an anon intruder, then I'd maybe think that might approach "most". Especially in the cases of suicide and domestic violence.
I'd imagine the CDC, FBI and the BCS would all have numbers and case studies on the above. But, folks, depending on which side of the aisle they sit, can make just about any conclusion with manipulation of the data, methinks.
Brian in SLC
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capndick4
Boulder climber
A place beyond reasoning
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I have to agree that a shotgun is the firearm of choice for home defense. I have one ready to go behind my front door. If you're concerned about holding the flashlight while sweeping the house for intruders you can buy a mount that holds a small light, or you can use a headlamp. Pump actions are the way to go as you can cycle 'low powered' shells through them with more ease than a semi auto.
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landcruiserbob
Trad climber
the ville, colorado
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No headlamps, unless they are red.You don't want become a perfect target.Point & shoot, let those(12ga.buckshot= 8 .38caliber rounds) do their work.rg
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Ouch!
climber
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Back in the old days. a serious meat hunter I knew would set up on the edge of an alfalfa field. Pick out a big buck and shoot him in the ribs with a .22. Then just sit and wait for a bit. It wouldn't spook him too bad. Then he would find him not far away. Bled out well and the meat didn't all taste like liver. He could sometimes get 4 or 5 before they spooked off.
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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The Sure-Fire (about 75,000 candlepower) I've got on my 11-87 cost more than my first shotgun total, and the twelve bore offers more varieties of rounds than anything.
Mine is judiciously located, and I even have one with a bayonet for guarding prisoners.
Still I like my Hydrashocks and something I can engage multiple targets with even faster than the fowling piece.
Like they say, "Any gun will do if YOU will do."
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ChoochCharlie
Trad climber
South East PA
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My choice is a 22 cal double action revolver. You can c*#k the hammer if you want, but you can also just squeeze the trigger. I load it with reduced velocity hollow points by CCI. Keep it in a gun safe, safe from my kids but still in my hand quickly.
The reduced velocity means it is quiet, like a cap gun. That and the hollow points should reduce a thru and thru.
"What am I protecting my family from?"
Intruders maybe. But I did use it on a rabid squirrel a few months ago. He had gone after my neighbor and was coming at me when I got him.
You need to practice with whatever you choose. And know your limitations. I am not bulls eye accurate at to great a distance. (shotgun folks have it there)
My uncle calls his self defense 25cal a belly gun. It is most accurate if you keep it hidden, then stick it in his belly.
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Chooch,
you've got single action and double action confused.
(I hope a rabid sqirrel is all you face.)
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Thom
Trad climber
South Orange County, CA
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First, let me say I have no children around so my gun is handy and loaded at all times...
I had the same question and asked around and got a similar answer from a number of people (i.e. a county sheriff, a handgun instructor and a couple of others who were pretty knowledgeable on the subject—all are personal friends). The answer went something like this:
The hardcore gun freaks will recommend hardcore weapons like shotguns, 357's and the like all of which sound impressive and do have the potential to do major damage, but are impractical in most situations for the average person. In any encounter that causes you to pull a gun, the assailant will probably be as amped up as you; you'll likely only get one shot off with higher-powered weapons for two reasons: the gun blast will probably startle you as much as the assailant; the kickback may cause you to drop the weapon. If you do hit them, something like a 357 will go right through—unless you hit something vital you may not stop them (on a personal note I know this to be true as I witnessed my father get shot through the gut, from about 10 feet away, by a 357; it went right through, tore the sh$t out of his back when it came out making a mess of our living room wall, but didn't lay him out. He survived; don't ask).
A .22 pistol was recommended for the following reasons: It has virtually no kick, no gun blast, and is easily handled. (As such, my wife had no fear of it and learned to use it with ease.) Unlike larger weapons, a .22 slug probably won't exit the victim but, instead, will bounce around off bones or whatever, potentially causing more internal damage; and, with no kick or gun blast you may actually get off more shots, more quickly.
Bigger weapons sound impressive. Unless you're trained and practiced in how to use them AND, PERHAPS MORE IMPORTANTLY, how to keep your cool at the very moment when your life may be in danger, those bigger weapons may do you more harm than good.
And so went the answer from people who I trust, that know guns.
I got the .22 handgun and I hope I never have to use it... but it's around.
T.
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StyMingersfink
climber
the 51st state.... denial
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Why don't you start like the rest of us started out? With a Daisy lever action B-B gun? Move up to a .22 after a bit, then get into the "real" sh#t.
It all comes down to economics. You can spen a couple of bucks on several thousand B-B's and not go deaf learning how to shoot out the neighbor's windows, cats or dogs, as well as the occasional winged thing. Another nice thing is that other than putting someone's eye out, you won't kill anyone by shooting it in the wrong direction.
Step up to the .22 rifle and go varmint hunting. Nothing more fun than getting drunk on a weekend afternoon an shooting at squirrels, frogs, rabbits, or pretty much anything else that moves.
Once you get that killing of things out of your system, get yourself a .22 pistol (love the ruger Mark II .22 for target shooting) and murder a few hundred budwiser cans (after you empty them, of course). Start at close range, then progress to a distance where you might hit the can 2 for 10 tries, without using the sights. This gives another meaning to the term "point and shoot".
Now you can step up to the big-boy guns, the .38's and .40's, .44's and .45's.(hell, throw in the 9 and 10mm's as well). Shoot as much as your budget will allow, but by this time you might realize THESE guns are not for fun, they're to KILL. Respect accordingly.
Of course, if you have children, they should be involved in this process all along. Instill a VERY deep respect for a tool which handled improperly can and will kill, at least as quickly as an automobile will.
PLEASE remember too, only UNLOADED guns kill people unintentionally. (every weapon i own is loaded at all times, at least that is the assumption you ought to make)
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Shack
Trad climber
So. Cal.
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Thom..
"Unless you're trained and practiced in how to use them AND, PERHAPS MORE IMPORTANTLY, how to keep your cool at the very moment when your life may be in danger, those bigger weapons may do you more harm than good."
That's the only thing that matters in what you said.
Unless you plan on never learning how to shoot, your a girl,
or you want a gun that won't make a loud noise that might scare you into dropping it....forget that advice.
If you don't take the time to learn to hit what your aiming for and have the competency and confidence to handle a firearm,
maybe you should just call 911 and leave the guns to those who are capable.
A .22 will still kill you, but is by no means the recomended
home defense choice. Ask a cop what he uses. It won't be a .22.
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Gary
climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
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The sound of chambering a round in the shotgun might send the bad guys running, but when they hear my Husqvarna Model 137 chainsaw fire up, well that really puts the fear of Jesus in 'em. Combine that with the chipper in the back, and it's like they were never there.
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coldclimb
climber
Wasilla, Alaska
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This thread has quite a bit of interesting advice. I don't know much about specific guns at all, but what I DO know is I have a really hard time being fast enough to shoot dogs out of the burn-barrel in my front yard when the BB-gun is leaning against the doorframe. Don't ask me what gun would be perfect for protection, but I do know you're not going to be able to lock the thing up at all and still use it. ;)
Fortunately, I AM the kid in my house, so I don't need to worry much. My grandpa's .270 Winchester leans against the wall a foot behind my head, on a shelf. Not for protection so much as just because I like guns. Personally, I'd probably dive for the knives on my dresser before trying to attack someone with a rifle indoors.
But yes, definitely do take your kids shooting. Heck, not only is it a safety concern, it's a TON of fun for them too!
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Blight
Social climber
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I've never seen a thread more replete with fear and hatred than this one. Are all americans so weak and so terrified of unnamed monsters that they feel they have to carry a gun?
Wow.
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macgyver
Social climber
Oregon, but now in Europe
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Like my namesake...I don't use or own guns. I have never gotten it. The risk to benefit ratio seems very high. However, reading about it is fascinating.
In the cases that have required me to defend myself, never would a gun have helped. It was always a surprise, close quarters, and very likely that a gun would discharge outside of either the assailant or my control.
Each time sharp objects, a brick, and just general primal desire to survive have been sufficient.
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ChoochCharlie
Trad climber
South East PA
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Thanks Ron. Edited.
Blight. "I've never seen a thread more replete with fear and hatred than this one. Are all americans so weak and so terrified of unnamed monsters that they feel they have to carry a gun?"
Broad brush you use. How strong are you?
And who said "carry". We are talking home use.
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Patrick Sawyer
climber
Originally California now Ireland
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Mother superior jump the gun
mother superior jump the gun
Happiness is a warm gun
Happiness is a warm gun mama
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Blight
Social climber
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"Broad brush you use. How strong are you?"
I'm sure there are stronger and weaker people than me. I've had guns pointed at me plenty of times. Can't say it really excited me, or that a gun of my own would have helped me any.
It should be fairly clear from this thread that most folks advocating owning a gun do so because they're afraid of something - their children being harmed, their apartment being invaded, their wallet being stolen, whatever.
To a weak person who is afraid of unnamed monsters doing unnamed things to them and theirs, the gun is a magic amulet to dispel their fears both by allowing them to believe they can defend themselves with just one finger, and by inviting them into a society of like-minded people who reinforce their common bond with jargon, tech-speak and the exchange of personal details about their pet firearms.
As anyone with experience knows, the reality of fighting for one's life is quite different to and altogether less satisfying than the good clean stand-up movie fights which are most folks' experience of it.
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