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YetAnotherDave
Trad climber
Vancouver, BC
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Agree with duncan on the lighter poop tube options, but unless you're up for weeks that still looks like overkill.
The big containers of protein powder are great one-wall tubes. Tight-sealing screwtops, beefy enough for slab hauling but weigh practically nothing. Really only good for one wall, but they come with food so there's always more around...
Some of the ledges on the Nose grossed me out in May, can't imagine late October. Thanks Tom for bringing this issue back to the foreground.
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atchafalaya
climber
Babylon
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River haul bags have always worked for me. Small, airtight, compressible. No way I would carry pvc or a bucket.
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Kupandamingi
Trad climber
Berkeley
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agree with river bags - though as someone said they don't fully insulate you from the stank. Big plus is they are cheap enough to just through away at the aptly named manure pile parking lot. Can keep them far enough away when on the climb, but whoever gets stuck carrying it for the walk off is screwed. As nice as it sounds for people to carry off there almost as wretched smelling 'dehydration' piss, that sounds really unrealistic to me. Perhaps just more strategic dumping of the yellow slim is required.
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Ottawa Doug
Social climber
Ottawa, Canada
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River dry bags with wag bag kit works every time. It has got to be the lightest, easiest to use option. This thread really is the $hit! :)
Cheers,
Doug
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Crimpergirl
Social climber
Boulder, Colorado!
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Ewww! Gnarly tales of poo.
Thanks for the great photos and text. I love reading these reports!
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up2top
Big Wall climber
Phoenix, AZ
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Karl wrote, "We need to get translations of Big Wall poop ethics into numerous different languages and posted in Camp 4 and in the big wall guidebooks, and heck even on the signpost leading to El Cap."
Can't we just kick them in the balls? Wouldn't that work better as a deterrent? I know -- doesn't solve the immediate problem, but I think they'd get the message for next time.
Ed
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Nefarius
Big Wall climber
somewhere without avatars.........
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Patagonia has a Compressor Route... Maybe EC needs a PressureWasher Route...?
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GDavis
Trad climber
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just leave a power washer at Camp V and tell Hans that for every minute he spends spraying it down he gets to take an extra minute and a half off of his total :D
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Nefarius
Big Wall climber
somewhere without avatars.........
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hahaha That'd be rad. :)
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Mighty Hiker
Social climber
Vancouver, B.C.
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If we don't self-regulate, and address the problem, it seems safe to guess that the NPS will eventually step in. Bearing in mind that human waste is a genuine health/safety problem, in addition to its environmental and aesthetic impacts on a national park. And is a common reason for increased resource management, as shown by the Grand Canyon.
NPS regulation would probably include a registration system for certain popular climbs, perhaps including a mandatory orientation/education session. It might extend to having parties check in at the bottom and top, proving that they had a system for waste storage, and used it. Hopefully DNA analysis of miscreants' poop wouldn't often be necessary.
Unless we do everything we can to clean up existing messes, and prevent creation of new ones, we may be facing the dreaded regulation issue. Maybe we need to send teams to the Nose, Salathe and other popular routes at next year's FaceLift, equipped to do a lot of clean up. Though as always, water supply may be the challenge.
And yes, we should deal with both solid and liquid wastes. Some effort is needed, but the technology isn't insuperable.
It's difficult to believe that people are so bone-headed as to 'go' in cracks, rather than over the edge. If you can't 'go' in a poop tube or equivalent, at least do it somewhere where there's a reasonable chance of natural cleaning action, and not on a climb.
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Blakeb
Big Wall climber
Ashland, Oregon
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Heard talk of people interested in filling the cracks that are full of waste, trash, fecies and urine on camp 5 and 6 with concrete or cement of some sort so that they could no longer be used as trash cans or turd dumpsters. When i first thought it over seemed like a great idea but still goes against the whole leave no trace policy, but if it fixes the greater problem is it acceptable.
Sorry to anyone out there that might not have wanted this brought up, but wanted to see what the masses would think of that.
blake
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Nefarius
Big Wall climber
somewhere without avatars.........
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I'd wager that since there is a fair bit of issue with people spackling the ledges and those cracks, as is evidenced by this thread, that cementing them would only cause more of an uproar.
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elcap-pics
climber
Crestline CA
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Topic Author's Reply - Oct 7, 2008 - 07:30pm PT
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Well it seems to me that if you can haul 10 gallons of water and god knows how many beers you could haul 3 gallons of urine off. One just has to make it a priority. Peeing over the edge of the ledge on most routes means peeing down the route... not good. Plus many parties collect the urine in a bottle of some kind and then in the morning pour it over the side... which just concentrates it even more. Plus having the pee just below the bivy smells bad and makes a bad experience for other climbers. You have to man up folks and take it with you... not on all routes mind you but on those two routes. If that is too much trouble for you then you deserve a shithole to bivy in... and all the regulation that will be sure to follow... don't come crying to me about how the NPS are a bunch of buttheads... take some action.
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Nefarius
Big Wall climber
somewhere without avatars.........
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I like what Jesse had to say, personally. So far, Jesse has been a very good replacement for Link, as our steward. Thanks, Jesse.
Seriously... Cement on The Captain? hahaha Bad idea. Period. Basically, we all just need to man up and either pick up after ourselves (which most of us do) and maybe go that little extra bit when we see something someone left behind. It's pretty simple, really.
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Blakeb
Big Wall climber
Ashland, Oregon
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You can laugh at me but folks are really talking about this cement bullsh#t, if you think it is a bad idea, folks should all speak up, before someone thinking they are going to be famous and appreciated fills the wholes.
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Mighty Hiker
Social climber
Vancouver, B.C.
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There's only a few weeks to go, to clean up Camp 6. As we all learned from Echo at the FaceLift, after 50 years, anything left by the first ascent party becomes an archaeological treasure instead of plain garbage. Poop becomes coprolites, which an archaeologist may examine to determine the diet and condition of the first ascent party. Scraps of Harding's shoelaces become something for the museum. There's no time to lose.
Sorry, I couldn't resist.
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