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knudeNoggin
climber
Falls Church, VA
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Jan 16, 2014 - 12:16pm PT
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This is tragic and sad. If you spent much of any time at Carderock, you were bound to at least HEAR Geoff's booming voice, typically giving advice. (Some such advice better fit his tall lanky frame than what you personally brought to the rocks. :o)
It's interesting to read the accounts and how odd they sound. E.g., there is a rather short, easy walk from the parking lot (70-100metres?) to the TOPs of the cliffs, which fall downwards to an arm of the Potomac --quite close (even over) at the downstream / southern /left-from-lot end, and more removed to the other, longer-extended end. I don't know the spot ... , but only recall any big wooden beams being downstream where bolstering is needed. Conceivably, the two above had climbed (class 4) down the roughly central access to the bottom and then saw the killer running away out to go (not even class 4) around the far upstream end and back to the lot)? --otherwise, it would be from the other end and the killer running away to the center access; but I don't think there are beams upstream?
Yeah, the claw hammer, a regular tool --esp. for TR !
So much for reporting ... .
*kN*
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fluffy
Trad climber
Colorado
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Jan 16, 2014 - 12:57pm PT
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If you spent much of any time at Carderock, you were bound to at least HEAR Geoff's booming voice, typically giving advice.
People talk about that like its a good thing. Maybe not everyone felt that way?
I know when I go climbing (or just about anywhere else) the last thing I'm looking for is someone else's booming unsolicited advice.
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knudeNoggin
climber
Falls Church, VA
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Jan 16, 2014 - 01:33pm PT
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Oh, no, I don't think that the booming Voice of Advice
was at all regarded as a joy; only that it was conspicuous.
Now, the R&Ice article's account 2nd hand from on-site
John Gregory (who wrote the Guide to the climbs, at least
at one vintage, IIRC?), is sooooooo damn different from
that other account : Geoff is alone but for coming upon
John --not jointly there as part of a quartet--,
there is no killer in sight (!),
and no mention of anyonElse --i.p., no mention of John's
joining anyone in making a grisly find?!
Now, for whom was John setting up TR --presumably
a belayer is intended (not auto-belay, but ... )?
Why is John not mentioned by those other two, who'd
gone ahead to set up TR and who walked around to
find Geoff after he didn't appear below for their climb?!
--damn strange trying to make sense of this all.
)-:
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Christopher Paik
Trad climber
md
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Jan 16, 2014 - 05:46pm PT
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John Gregory and another climber were with Geoff in the parking lot. Geoff mentioned that he and LIttle Dave had had an argument. All three climbers walked one hundred yards down to the top of the cliff. Geoff went down the 4th class descent, while the other two remained at the top to set up a top rope. After setting up the top rope, the two went down the descent, with John first. Dave came running past John and went up the descent to the parking lot, got in his car and left. John found Geoff on the ground.
At least this is my understanding, from conversations with some of the people who were there.
To forestall pointless and inaccurate speculation, allow me to state that it was no secret that Little Dave had had mental health problems; indeed, his father has said as much to a Washington Post reporter. In view of this, it may be the case that this awful event is a tragedy for all involved.
It is worth noting that the prosecutor has stated that the forensic evidence is inconsistent with LIttle Dave's claim of self-defense.
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knudeNoggin
climber
Falls Church, VA
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Jan 16, 2014 - 09:01pm PT
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It's impossible for people who have spent time at Carderock not to speculate ...
But it's not so much speculation as correction to what are obvious flaws in the reporting, sometimes hilariously so. In another thread on this site someone posted the URLink to an affidavit by an investigating officer, and that really puts the events in sharp relief in terms of timing --esp. if the view taken by John & partner from up high was assured of covering the ground soon thereafter (3mins) bloodied! And "running down the trail" when the fellow is going smack beside them and up class-4 rise to the parking-lot level of terrain.
<geesh>
Apparently, the 4 were not entirely alone. I surmise that there were some others to the upstream / N bigger half of the cliffs.
*kN*
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John Ely
Trad climber
DC
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Jan 17, 2014 - 09:52am PT
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Geoff's friend Dave Rockwell has posted a long but very fine photo essay about his long friendship with Geoff Farrar.
And my one big question regarding much of the speculation above. Where the f*** did the hammer come from, from whose car trunk, and who brought in down to the base of cripple's crack? A 'claw hammer' or even a Yosemite hammer lying there at any time of the day or night is about as likely as a porcupine found in my mother's living room. And: did anyone hear or have any idea about the nature or content of the earlier dispute between the two of them in the parking lot?
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jstan
climber
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Jan 17, 2014 - 12:28pm PT
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If there were other witnesses in the area, I would think it very important they not participate in discussions such as this.
If anyone feels they have information they might best contact the authorities and not discuss any of this with anyone nor follow these threads.
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RP3
Big Wall climber
Sonora
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Jan 17, 2014 - 01:07pm PT
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WOW. Such a tragedy. I climbed at Carderock once a couple of years ago while visiting family in the DC area. We met Geoff and he lined us out for the day of climbing. How sad...
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Lorenzo
Trad climber
Oregon
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Topic Author's Reply - Jan 17, 2014 - 06:37pm PT
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And my one big question regarding much of the speculation above. Where the f*** did the hammer come from, from whose car trunk, and who brought in down to the base of cripple's crack? A 'claw hammer' or even a Yosemite hammer lying there at any time of the day or night is about as likely as a porcupine found in my mother's living room.
Oh, I don't know. I helped put the original RR ties in the pictures you see, and that boardwalk above. I used a hammer then.
There are lots of reasons a hammer could be there.
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John Ely
Trad climber
DC
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On May 18, folks met for a memorial for Geoff Farrar in the parking lot of the Carderock top roping area. Some nice thoughts, good eats and lazy bouldering. Dave Rockwell didn't take any pictures, but made some excellent comments and came up with the right picture.
http://davefiddleswithcameras.blogspot.com/
Here are a couple of bad pictures I snapped just to prove what he describes nicely above happened.
We all still miss Geoff. I find violence of human against human so abhorrent. This all seems so sad and unnecessary, in some ways the very opposite of a climbing accident, which is as we all know a deliberate part of the game.....
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steve jones
Ice climber
Fairfax, VA
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Any further news on Dave and a trial etc? I see he was released from the Feds on Sept. 10th of 2015
Thanks
Steve
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