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johndoeX
Social climber
NY
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Nov 11, 2006 - 07:16pm PT
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"Question johndoex, is it fact that during the 90's there had been intercepted communications from various terrorists that had similar plans for using aircraft as weapons or at least large scale mayhem and murder? Did the FAA send out any warnings during those years? Thanks for the link, that is one to bookmark!"
Prior to 9/11, I have never seen an internal report indicating the above from the FAA.
After 9/11... well... just check here if you really want to get angry..
http://www.secure-skies.org/
"Quick Stats
# Airline Flts per day: 28,000
Airborne Right Now: 4988
Flights Protected by 2
Armed Pilots:
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johndoeX
Social climber
NY
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Nov 11, 2006 - 07:26pm PT
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My above reply got cut for some reason.
I will not be able to check these forums for questions unfortunately. If anyone has questions.. feel free to email us at pilots@pilotsfor911truth.org or sign up at our forums at http://forums.pilotsfor911truth.org.
I had seen this forum referred to our site and wanted to respond to the above post regarding "nuts" to set the record straight. Ridicule is a form most often used by the ignorant. Sometimes use as a defense mechanism. It's abundant when trying to question your govt.. This... in America.
We welcome questions in our forum, but please use the search function first prior to asking as many topics are covered. We do not feed trolls.. we kick them to the curb. We provide a friendly atmosphere to share research and opinions based on experience. Its also not just for pilots.
Feel free to pick up your own quality DVD of Pandora's Black Box - Analysis of American 77 Flight Data Recorder. It is the first part in a series we are producing covering all flights of Sept 11, 2001.. All proceeds contribute to further research and lower quality versions can be seen for free on the website.
http://pilotsfor911truth.org/store.html
Thanks for your support...
Cheers!
Rob
Co-Founder
http://pilotsfor911truth.org
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johndoeX
Social climber
NY
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Nov 11, 2006 - 07:27pm PT
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LEB.. google PNAC
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snooky
climber
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Nov 11, 2006 - 07:27pm PT
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Thanks johndoex. Scary is correct. Flight Protected by Air Marshals {6%}. Defenseless Flights: 94%. Taxes Spent on Airline Security $12B
$600B or so spent on the fiasco (and counting) that is the Iraq occupation should make safe. Maybe our pal Grover can drown Airline Safety budgets in a bath tub and be a proud fiscal conservative. No wonder those regressive fools had their asses handed to them last Tuesday.
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WBraun
climber
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Nov 11, 2006 - 07:31pm PT
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common healyje
These guys here don't know anything about wireless systems that exist now or how they work for this type of application if something like that would have been implemented.
A wireless trigger system will not be implemented in the way you or these speculators up thread are describing it.
healyje do you even know some of the wireless systems that are available and how it interfaces to the hardware, plus their encryption capabilities?
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Klimmer
Mountain climber
San Diego
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Nov 11, 2006 - 08:00pm PT
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HJ,
Why do I bother?
JohnDoeX,
Thanks for all your hard work with Pilots for 9-11 Truth. I will certainly order a copy of said DVD. Thanks for letting us know. Your website is great, I think I will frequent more often and maybe join? Do you accept Paraglider pilots (lol)?
WBraun,
True. It is simply my speculation on how they set-off the charges. Whether they hard-wired the CD or did it wireless, is anyone's guess and it is speculation. All I am saying is that the technology is very available and done often. It would seem to me wireless would be the way to go. Far-less time to set and easier logistics.
Look at what is possible for large computer controlled and very elaborate fire-work shows. They can set-off and detonate the explosives and rockets in precisely the order they want for all kinds of effects, even syncronized to music. I believe some of these shows are done wire-less???? Don't know.
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graniteclimber
Trad climber
Nowhere
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Nov 11, 2006 - 08:02pm PT
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johndoeX,
Why is a founder of a public advocacy group (supposedly a bona fide group of commercial airline pilots), posting on behalf of the group, posting as "johndoeX?"
Edit: Never mind. Rob already posted a link to his name at http://www.pilotsfor911truth.org/core.html
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Nov 11, 2006 - 08:10pm PT
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johndoeX,
Again, my Father is a retired United captain who started in biplanes and retired from 747's. Moreover, he was test pilot for the Navy and an expert in radio, TV, instruments, and radar and flew the first instrument landings every in the U.S. He also one of the key test pilots and radar specialists working with MIT on Project Cadillac II which produced the first viable AWACS prototypes. My older brother who went to the Air Force Academy is 6'3" and played tightend for them and is intimidated by no man, and my younger brother is as gifted and "natural" a pilot as can be found. When these three pilots cast aspersion on your group and it's "conclusions" - be it by employing ridicule or not - I can assure you they do it from exemplary backgrounds with in-depth expertise and the experience to back it up. If they say it didn't happen that way - it didn't happen that way - that and the facts and physical evidence speak for themselves...
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WBraun
climber
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Nov 11, 2006 - 08:11pm PT
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And why are you posting as graniteclimber instead of your own true name, same thing, eh? Hypocrite are you not graniteclimber?
Klimmer, I appreciate what you are doing with your inquiry about this subject matter and sharing it here. Thanks again.
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Nov 11, 2006 - 08:16pm PT
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Yes Werner, I do. Have I made any, no, but I know neither the physical access nor was a wireles detonation system reliable enough to be capable of what is claimed available. And just physically installing explosives, which was impossible due to the massive effort it would take to cover all the necssary columns, wouldn't work either as there would again have been no synchronization and multiple large explosions over time would have been filmed by no shortage of media crews.
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johndoeX
Social climber
NY
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Nov 11, 2006 - 08:33pm PT
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Healy.. your dad flying as one of the first pilots shooting approaches speak volumes about his position. He is correct there are many errors in pitot-static instruments. But we have come a long way since. Please review the NASA report linked regarding airdata and calibration in which it covers how position errors and hysteresis are eliminated in modern equipment and Air Data Computers (ADC/MADC). Also please review the conflicts that arise should there be any type of instrument error regarding increased vertical speed conflicting with the DoD video.
As far as me being "johndoeX"? Many people know me by that online name.. however if you had clicked on the link provided ..you will see me right at the top..
http://www.pilotsfor911truth.org/core.html
Please review the others in our organization and their experience/backgrounds. Many top individuals in their respective fields.
The reason i came here is because i saw this forum as being referred under my hit counter to my site (i like to visit the sites who link to my site every once in a while). When i saw we were being called "nuts" and not credible.. i had to sign up to at least set the record straight. Unfortunately when you start questioning the govt face to face.. you get a bunch of cowards on other forums trying to discredit you without facing you. Such as Healy and his "fathers" and brother.
Anyone here care to give me their real name? How about you Healy? Do you have your father and brothers name so i can look them up in the FAA database? Thanks...
All others.. thank you very much for your support! We are trying to get answers from our govt. and we wont stop till we do..
Rob
Co-founder
pilotsfor911truth.org
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Nov 11, 2006 - 08:38pm PT
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He wasn't one of the "first pilots shooting approaches" he was THE first U.S. pilot to fly them. And he has kept abreast of the trends in electronics, avionics, and instrumentation well past his retirement.
I use my real name, and my Father and brothers are all in the database; as I said, dad is retired United and both Brothers are Fedex.
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graniteclimber
Trad climber
Nowhere
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Nov 11, 2006 - 08:39pm PT
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As far as me being "johndoeX"? Many people know me by that online name.. however if you had clicked on the link provided ..you will see me right at the top..
http://www.pilotsfor911truth.org/core.html[/i]
You are correct and I already edited my post to so note.
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johndoeX
Social climber
NY
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Nov 11, 2006 - 08:42pm PT
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"He wasn't one of the "first pilots shooting approaches" he was THE first U.S. pilot to fly them. And he has kept abreast of the trends in electronics, avionics, and instrumentation well past his retirement"
Healy.. .is your Dad's name Jimmy Doolittle? Cause that is the first pilot to develop instruments and shoot approaches.
your dad and brother may be in the FAA database... but how do we know that? So far, you havent shown anything of substance.. you are a person posting on some type of (what seems to be) a rock climbing forum. You may take what you read on a forum as gospel.. however, i like to have source material.
Again.. please review the entire site and analysis before passing judgement. That goes for your dad and brother as well. Feel free to have them contact me if they can offer any explanation that hasnt been covered as the NTSB doesnt seem very forthcoming (im assuming you watched the NTSB phone call video..)
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Klimmer
Mountain climber
San Diego
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Nov 11, 2006 - 08:50pm PT
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HJ,
Bingo you answered your own reasoning . . .
" . . . and multiple large explosions over time would have been filmed by no shortage of media crews."
You are right and we have that and much, much more.
We have seismic data, visual data galore, audio data, and many, many eye-witness testimonies from firemen, police officers, rescue workers all whom witnessed the explosives even at times getting thrown by the explosives. Not to mention the explosive residue in the 9-11 dust, and a study done by the USGS that bears out the "finger-print" of explosives. Then there is also the cutter charge residue from the Thermite/Thermate that Dr. Jones has found on the wreckage of the towers. More to come on all of this. People are doing good work and getting the evidence.
We even have the testimony of William Rodriguez, American hero, metaled by Bush himself for his heroism on 9-11 who witnessed along with many other people the explosions that went off in the basements of WTC towers 1 and 2, just prior to the towers being hit by jets. MIHOP all the way.
No matter what, OCTers can't wish all this evidence away, regardless of how hard you wish or try.
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Nov 11, 2006 - 09:07pm PT
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Klimmer,
It's really unbelievable the degree which you and your's fabricate and extrapolate fact and data. Really, and people wonder how the right could have so thoroughly taken in the country. I consider you and yours to be guilty of exactly same kind of malfeasance in manufacturing fact and data as the Bush administration itself. I consider both the 9/11 conspiracists and the Bush administration equally guilty of exactly the same sort of malicious fear mongering - you're both just opposite sides of the same coin.
And as I've related elsewhere, I worked with data from every intelligence agency, civilian and defense when I was in the Navy working directly and daily with the flag intelligence officer responsible for the Pacific Fleet intel and none of them - ZERO, NADA, ZIP - and no branch of the military was or is remotely capable of managing anything like an operation of this scope and scale and coordinate in secrecy across so many federal, state, and local agencies. At every level the very idea is not only implausible, but inconceivable. It did not happen.
Bush and company are guilty of treason as far as I'm concerned and all should be tried - but for incompetence and devotion to an idealogical fantasy, not for have perpetrated one on the American public. Again, the differnce between you folks, the administration, Vatican, the UFO's advocates, lunar landing deniers, HIV deniers, and the Intelligent Designers is just a thread and all are sign of deep cultural disease as far as I'm concerned - and one that deeply undermines our standing in the world in the future.
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Klimmer
Mountain climber
San Diego
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Nov 11, 2006 - 09:22pm PT
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HJ,
I feel for you. I know hearing the truth is difficult. You can't take all the conflicting emotions inside, and it is apparent. Try not to melt down too much in a public forum. It's kind of embarrassing . . .
Try to get some climbing in tomorrow. You need it.
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Nov 11, 2006 - 09:30pm PT
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Klimmer, I get in plenty of climbing and have the requisite emotional bandwidth to process anything that comes along in life. What I don't have is an abundance of tolerance for suffering bullshit and those who seek to truck in it under the guise of legitimate science, engineering, or inquiry.
But hey, it's your pitchfork, wield it as you please, but I'm telling you the moon is staying put...
P.S. Outa here for dinner with the beauty...
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graniteclimber
Trad climber
Nowhere
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Nov 11, 2006 - 10:25pm PT
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I looked through the pilotsfor911truth.org web site
The web site is in Glen Stanish's name. He is also listed as a founder. Seems he is the author of the book, "UNCLE SAM'S CHRISTIAN PATRIOTS: A Personal, Political and Religious Discussion of September the 11th, War and Peace, and Freedom and Oppression" From the review, it sounds like it is very rabidly anti-semetic, making allegations that various top government officials were Zionist agents and the like. See the review at: http://www.rumormillnews.com/cgi-bin/forum.cgi?noframes;read=87696
Birds of a feather? It is unfair to judge the whole group by the possible positions of one person but it is not very portentious.
Turning to the pilotsfor911truth.org site itself, there are some technical arguments made regarding Flight 77 (the plane that hit the Pentagon), but nothing conclusive. Boiled down, they postulate that hitting the Pentagon would be too difficult for some terrorist noob terrorist pilot: "My conclusion is, the manever looks possible, for guys like me and you. But for Hani? unlikely." Weak!
There is very little else of substance. Their biggest argument can be paraphrased as follows: "The terrorists took over the planes with knives and boxcutters? I NEVER would have let that happen to my plane! No REAL pilot would let the happen! So we don't believe it!"
On Flight 93 (the plane that crashed into the ground in Pennsylvania) they claim that because the flight data shows the plane descending at a 40 degree pitch down it should have left a "long ditch" instead of a relatively round crater. The implication is that because there was a roundish crater, the flight data is fraudulent and evidence of a cover-up.
Maybe the forensic analysis of ballistics is outside of their expertise. While I'm not an expert myself, I recall reading about research on the angle of impact on crater size by astronomers. It seems that even low angle impacts create a circular crater unless it is VERY low angle. Juan? What do you know of this?
They note that the ground was soft, as if this would have made "long ditch" more likely, although from basic principles of physics, you'd expect that to the extent it would make a difference, the softer the ground, the less likely this would be!
Edit: I googled up an article on impact craters. It states, "Craters most often are circular. More elongate craters can be produced if an impactor strikes the surface at a very low angle — less than 20 degrees." Based on this, it would appear that pilotsfor911truth.org's theory is wrong and a round crater is consistent with the flight data.
http://www.lpi.usra.edu/education/explore/shaping_the_planets/impact_cratering.shtml
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WBraun
climber
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Nov 11, 2006 - 10:55pm PT
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Hey ......
They never went to the moon, no sireee ...... Bawhwahahaha
And it's true, so sorry to blow you away with this terrible truth.
You will never be able to sleep well again knowing that "things are not what they seem".
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