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Brandon-
climber
The Granite State.
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May 20, 2013 - 07:51pm PT
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Give it time, our resident Valley geologist will chime in when it's appropriate.
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Captain...or Skully
climber
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May 20, 2013 - 07:55pm PT
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Sorry to hear of things sometimes. condolences.
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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May 20, 2013 - 08:03pm PT
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hey there say, melissa... it may be hard? to understand more--i was thinking as to the noise that mark mentioned, as an 'explosion'...
perhaps a huge boulder? smashed on impact somewhere, going down?? and 'rained' downward, with more rockfall?
to make such a noise?--does anyone know, how that would be?
different than usual rockslides, or not?
i could not understand how else, the noise came, :(
perhaps photos, later, may show things that are missing? from that part of el cap?
i don't understand these things, either, though--and since mark was there, i tried to, the other night--concerning ALL the climbers, not just my brother...
i understand that it won't make things any safer for folks, knowing, but it helps ease the pain, for those that know those that die, mason, in this case,
by setting their mind to stop 'racing through the event' and be able to let it rest with some kind of resolved end...
dear family, you are in my prayers, for the pain you are going through, and may help you through the years, as you go onward, without your loved one... :(
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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May 20, 2013 - 08:17pm PT
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The cliffs are in constant transition, so one could never make El Cap "safe".
That said, it could be made safer with a concerted effort.
I have always thought that a similar project on a much smaller scale SHOULD be done on Yellow Spur.
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Clint Cummins
Trad climber
SF Bay area, CA
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May 20, 2013 - 08:24pm PT
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Yes, I wonder the same thing about the static haul line.
Although on the Bob Locke accident on Mt. Watkins, he took a longer fall,
then the lead line broke after a delay and he fell probably 50m and was caught by the (likely dynamic) haul line.
He still died.
It depends on what you hit, but in a long fall, broken ribs lead to a punctured lung, blood in the lungs, and tension pneumothorax.
http://www.supertopo.com/climbers-forum/444343/Bob-Locke-Memorial-Buttress-Mt-Watkins-Story
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mike m
Trad climber
black hills
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May 20, 2013 - 08:26pm PT
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In Melissa's photo there is a large flake that looks like it is slung. Is it possible a that in a large fall that could have pulled? If that is the case it looks like it would likely land on the rope.
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Clint Cummins
Trad climber
SF Bay area, CA
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May 20, 2013 - 08:28pm PT
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Yes, that was Melissa's point.
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Clint Cummins
Trad climber
SF Bay area, CA
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May 20, 2013 - 08:34pm PT
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We routinely trundle loose stuff when doing new routes, but they are in remote places with nobody below.
As we know, trundling has also killed and maimed people.
If done with a proper "ground crew", it can be done safely, though.
On El Cap, Donini et al witnessed how far debris can spread out when something breaks up high - it could be complicated and require closing a large area (maybe for a short amount of time, though).
Although when we hear more about the second (larger) rockfall on Sunday, we might wonder how much we would reduce the risks.
As for sharing information on loose rock hazards, we already have the beta section of this website. I don't see much recently on hazards on the Muir Wall:
http://www.supertopo.com/rock-climbing/route_beta.php?r=ybelmuir
Back in 1998 when I did it, we read recent trip reports to get an understanding of the difficult sections, as people still do.
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SalNichols
Big Wall climber
Richmond, CA
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May 20, 2013 - 08:35pm PT
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There's a big difference between the visible pieces and the path of the lead rope in Lambone's pic and Melissa's pic. Is this a difference due to nailing vs a "clean" ascent at the same point? Lambone's partner clearly has a point low in the main corner, vs up in the trash as shown in Melissa's pic. I'd like to see as many pics as possible of the same point in the most recent (say 2 yrs) ascents, including what the corner looks like now.
You monkeys need to understand the dynamics of this accident, because it could have gone off on anyone.
If Mason's passing teaches us all something, then his loss won't be a complete waste.
Peace.
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nita
Social climber
chica de chico, I don't claim to be a daisy.
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May 20, 2013 - 08:41pm PT
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I had a fitful sleep last night, my dreams were peppered with rock fall and death...I woke up feeling very out of sorts...
My thoughts go out to Mason's climbing partner, YOSAR's and all those who witness this tragedy.
Sending my deepest condolences to Mason's friends and Family.. ..
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Mark Hudon
Trad climber
Hood River, OR
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May 20, 2013 - 08:44pm PT
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Trying to pry all the loose blocks off of the popular routes is a Sisyphean task if there ever was one.
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climbski2
Mountain climber
Anchorage AK, Reno NV
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May 20, 2013 - 09:02pm PT
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klaus I have to wonder if he was wearing a helmet (was he? I don't know)
I thought I could see a helmet but it was not on his head after the fall. It appeared there was a helmet off to one side.
I got a very close up look at the situation. Hoping I might be able to help by observation. A lot was trying to be pieced together in the early minutes of this tragedy. Hope that he might come to and start moving like Ammon did. Sadly help was not possible. Part of me wants to share or vent more but there is no point to it in a public forum.
For friends and family perhaps it will help to know that there was absolutely no suffering.
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Lambone
Big Wall climber
Ashland, Or
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May 20, 2013 - 09:08pm PT
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There's a big difference between the visible pieces and the path of the lead rope in Lambone's pic and Melissa's pic. Is this a difference due to nailing vs a "clean" ascent at the same point? Lambone's partner clearly has a point low in the main corner, vs up in the trash...
Pretty certain my partner just went more straight up that corner vs into that stuff to the right. And we definately didn't sling that ugly block. Not that it matters but this pitch went clean.
Of course, I can't comment on what Mason did.
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ionlyski
Trad climber
Kalispell, Montana
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May 20, 2013 - 09:42pm PT
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Just talked to Marc, Mason's partner. They are (were) both friends though I know Marc much more, having climbed together years. He is driving back to Montana as I type this and I can't imagine how difficult it is now.
Perhaps he'll chime in on the thread when he gets home and maybe give some accuracy to the photos of the flake, etc.
Arne
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Ed Hartouni
Trad climber
Livermore, CA
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May 20, 2013 - 09:45pm PT
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my deepest sympathy to Mark and to Mason's family and friends
what tragedy
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johnnyrebel
Trad climber
heart of Texas
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May 20, 2013 - 09:47pm PT
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condolences to friends and family
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Lambone
Big Wall climber
Ashland, Or
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May 20, 2013 - 09:47pm PT
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....driving back to Montana as I type this...
alone? omg...worst drive ever...
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slobmonster
Trad climber
OAK (nee NH)
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May 20, 2013 - 09:48pm PT
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Terrible, petrifying, and awful. I've been thinking about this incident all day, and I know I'm not alone. Take care of each other, people.
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alleyehave
Trad climber
San Diego, CA
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May 20, 2013 - 10:21pm PT
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I've been pondering the haul line question as well. I, like most people use a static haul line...That might change.
Condolences to his family, partner, friends as well as all YOSAR personnel involved.
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johntp
Trad climber
socal
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May 20, 2013 - 10:30pm PT
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I had a fitful sleep last night, my dreams were peppered with rock fall and death...I woke up feeling very out of sorts...
My thoughts go out to Mason's climbing partner, SAR's and all those who witness this tragedy.
Me too. Between this and other recent incidents, it is just hard to focus on the mundane daily BS.
John Penca
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