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karabin museum
Trad climber
phoenix, az
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Topic Author's Reply - Sep 20, 2014 - 02:10pm PT
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Wow this was a lot of work, but I think I have the lineup correct.
Hexentrics
First introduced in 1971.
1971 Hexentric, set #1-7 slung, A-symetrical shape, #1-4 are solid, #5-7 have a round hole through the length of the Hex, large cord holes, stamp (USA “C” #) on side of Hex, no “Hexentric” stamp.
1972 Hexentric, #8-10 slung added with teardrop shape hole through length of Hex, A-symetrical shape, stamp (USA “C” #) on side of Hex, no “Hexentric” stamp, large cord holes, I have also seen the # stamp on top of the Hex for #9 and 10, but more commonly on the side.
Sometime in 1972 the “Hexentric” stamp was added to the back of the Hex, while the # stamp was on the front.
1972 catalog shows a photo of a young Yvon Chouinard wearing a gear sling with drilled Hexentrics on it. Hexentrics with drilled lightening holes became available in 1976. Yvon said that he created a few drilled sets in 1972 for friends of his.
1973 the Hexentric shape changed to the Polycentric shape, named “Schizophrenic Hexentrics,” #1-10 slung, large cord holes, #4-7 have a somewhat round hole through length of Hex, #8-10 have a somewhat teardrop shape with two corners through length of Hex, stamp (USA “C” #) on hex front and “Hexentric” stamp is added on Hex back.
1973 Hexentric, #1 wired is introduced (no plastic wire keeper), polycentric shape, “Hexentric” stamp, stamped “DL” - donated by Don Lauria, At the end of 1972 into 1973 this #1 wired Hexentric became available. I am curious if anybody has a 1972 A-symetrical style #1 wired Hexentric.
Late 1973 the “Hexentric” stamp on #4-10 was moved to the Hex front accompanying the number stamp on the slung Hexes, the # stamp order changes to (“C” USA #), large cord holes, Polycentric shape. #1-3 stamp order remains (USA “C” #).
1974 Hexentric #1 wired, colored plastic wire keeper added on wires (not on swag), polycentric shape,
1974 Hexentric #11 is introduced, Polycentric shape, large cord holes, This Hex was donated by Art Christiansen who used Chouinard paper Hex templates to mark where lightening holes were to be drilled. Art never drilled the holes.
Winter 1974 Chouinard created paper templates so customers could home drill lightening holes into their Hexentrics,
1975 Hexentric #1-3 wired, somewhat clear plastic wire keeper on swag, polycentric shape,
1976 Hexentric #7-11 introduced with drilled lightening holes, polycentric shape, stamp (“C” USA #) moved to top and at outer edge of Hex, this is a good identifier to see if holes are factory drilled or home drilled, large cord holes,
1978 the cord holes were reduced on Hex sizes #6-11, from 9mm to 8mm size. Tom Frost said that the cord knots were too big, and it was unnecessary for them to hold over 3000lbs. In the 1978 spring catalog it shows Hexes with lightening holes, but in the text it mentions that they no longer offer them.
In 1978 Hexentrics with lightening holes were discontinued. A new 1978 polycentric shape was introduced, on the larger sizes the inner shape of the Hex matches the outer shape, #1-3 wired with somewhat clear plastic wire keeper on swag, #1-11 slung with large cord holes, Hexes #1-4 are solid, Hexes #5-11 are hollow, stamp (“C” USA # and “Hexentric”) on side of Hex or on top,
1981 wired Hexentric #1-3, white paper label with small “Tested” word added under somewhat clear plastic wire keeper on swag, Tested word in light blue, blue or red ink,
1988 Hexentric #11 is discontinued, new Hexentric shape is introduced, the ends of the previous Hexes are cut on a downward angle, the new Hex #4-10 is cut on a downward and forward angle, if you lay down the Hex on its largest surface, it will reveal its trapezoid shape. #1-3 wired, small white print “tested” word on colored paper, somewhat clear plastic wire keeper on swag. (88, 89, 90 catalog does not show a photo of wired Hexes so I am not positive this colored test label was used but I assume it was since the wired Stoppers and wired Hexentrics seem to follow the same pattern of manufacturing). #1-10 slung, small 5.5mm cord holes, stamp (“C” USA # and “Hexentric”) on side of #4-10 Hex, or on top for #10,
1990 Hexentrics #1-3 slung are discontinued. Company changes from Chouinard to Black Diamond. Hexes are still stamped “C” in diamond.
1991 wired Hexentrics #1-3 have large “TESTED” label print on colored paper under somewhat clear plastic wire keeper on swag, Hexes are still stamped “C.” I have not found any of these yet nor does the catalog show them, but the Tested labels on the Stoppers in the past followed the same as the wired Hexentrics, so I assume these Hexentrics exist.
1993 Hexentrics have a new “BD” stamp added, #1-3 wired (“BD” “C” USA #)(“Hexentric” on back). #4-10 slung stamp (“BD” ”C” USA # and “Hexentric”) together, small 5.5mm cord holes, #1-3 wired have large “TESTED” label print on colored paper under somewhat clear plastic wire keeper, a Registered “R” stamp is added on the right end of the stamp “Hexentric,” The number stamp on the three wired Hexes are small, the number stamp on the slung Hexes are large with small “c” stamp in diamond. I write this description since the 1993 set and 1995 set are very close in comparison. I show the differences side by side in photos under the 1995 Hex listing.
1995 Hexentrics, #1-3 wired (“BD””C” USA #)(“Hexentric” on back), large “TESTED” label print on colored paper under somewhat clear plastic wire keeper. #4-10 slung stamp (“BD””C”USA # and “Hexentric”) together, Registered “R” symbol right of “Hexentric” stamp, small 5.5mm cord holes, The number stamp on the three wired Hexes are large, the number stamp on the slung hexes are large with large “C” stamp in diamond. The 1993 and 1995 slung Hexes are very close in comparison, The easiest way to identify the differences are with the size of the “c” stamp in the diamond, but if you look close at comparing the numbers on the Hexes, you will see minor differences where two sets of different number stamps were used.
1996 Hexentrics, #1-3 wired gets new colored “Sigma Three” test label, number stamps are reduced in size, test label is under somewhat clear plastic wire keeper.
Late 1996 Hexentrics. #1-3 wired Hexes number stamps are increased in size, colored “Sigma Three” test label under somewhat clear plastic wire keeper, stamp (“BD””C”USA #) on front and (“Hexentric””R”) on back, not sure why Black Diamond kept making the number stamps small, then big, then small, then big?
1997 Hexentrics, #11 slung is reintroduced, #1-3 wired Hexes get new stamp (“Hexentric””R””BD””C”USA #) on same side, colored “Sigma Three” test label under somewhat clear plastic wire keeper, Slung #4-11 Hexes are same as 1995 set but #11 is added.
1998 Hexentrics, #1-3 wired tested label is changed, colored “Sigma Three” test label now has words “Black Diamond Equipment USA” added and plastic wire keeper is now crystal clear.
1999 Hexentrics, #4-11 Hexes slung non colored same set as 1995, #1-11 wired set and all Hexes are color anodized in three different colors - (gray, pinkish red, yellow gold), stamp (“Hexentric””R””BD””C”USA #) on same side, white “Sigma Three” test label under crystal clear wire keeper,
2001 Slung Hexes are discontinued.
2003 Hexentrics, New “BD” company logo added, #1-11 wired, Hexes are color anodized in three different colors - (dark gray, salmon, gold), the colors are slightly different than the 1999 set, Hexes are stamped with only BD new logo and Hex #, Olive color “Sigma Three” test label under crystal clear wire keeper,
2006 Hexentrics, Hex colors are changed and test label color changed, #1-11 wired, Hexes are anodized in three different colors - (black, red, yellow gold), Hexes are stamped with only BD new logo and Hex #, white color “Sigma Three” test label under crystal clear wire keeper. Many of these Hexes as they were being changed from the 2003 to 2006 version still have olive test labels mixed with the white test labels, some of the white labels are marked “Black Diamond Equipment USA,” and some of the test labels are marked “Black Diamond Equipment.” The “USA” was removed. In 2006 Black Diamond Asia was established in Zhuhai, China.
2014 Hexentrics, I stopped at the Hiking Shack today and this is what is being sold on the shelves September 2014. The colors are: (gray, pinkish red, and speckley yellow gold). The tested labels are the same as 2006, white “Sigma Three” test label under crystal clear plastic wire keeper. Label says: “Black Diamond Equipment.” No “USA” since they are made in China.
……………………………………………………………………………………..
Does anybody have a #1 wired A-symetrical 1971 Hexentric?
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ClimbingOn
Trad climber
NY
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Sep 20, 2014 - 04:07pm PT
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Fantastic work on the hexes. You motivated me to dig out my Chouinard hexes and look to see if I have anything you do not. A few notes/questions:
1981 red label #3 next to what I assume is a 1978 #3. The 1978 is noticeably smaller. Any idea why the shift in size?
Another example of different #5s:
A question - I believe the hex with holes is a Chouinard hex but it has no markings on it. It is between a #8 and a #9 for size comparison. Do all of yours from 1976 have markings?
Lastly, I believe these are a pair of Chouinard Bigwall Boots. Any idea what year they were made?
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guido
Trad climber
Santa Cruz/New Zealand/South Pacific
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Sep 20, 2014 - 06:09pm PT
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Heck Marty, I can't miss getting a plug in with all your wonderful Hex paraphernalia and history.
Last year, as part of our "Climbing Heritage Series," we designed a tee shirt around the original Hex patent with some input from Tom. Here are a couple of shots of the design with DR and Tom showing off the shirt at Oakdale and an image of the "Big Daddies of Clean Climbing" signing on to the project. The shirts are available from of our company PatentWear at www.patentwear.com. Shameless hey what?
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karabin museum
Trad climber
phoenix, az
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Topic Author's Reply - Sep 25, 2014 - 09:06pm PT
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ClimbingOn, When the Hexentric shape changed in 1981, they reshaped all of the nuts, not just the larger ones. This is why you have two different size #3s.
For Hexentrics with drilled lightening holes, my #7, 8, 10, 11 have stamps on the top. My #9 has no stamp but I think it is home drilled due to the rough look of the lightening holes. The factory drilled holes are very clean without any visual drill gouges. I am not sure how the factory polished down all of the holes and sides of all of the Hexes they produced. Maybe they drill then cut then tumble the hexes then stamp them afterwards(?), or they hand polish all of them individually to get rid of the rough edges. Wow that’s a lot of work! Most home drilled Hexes are pretty obvious that they are home drilled. Look at the holes. Putting the stamp on the top is what makes the most sense for the factory to create. But at the same time they may have just took all of the stock Hexes they had on their shelf at the time, and drilled holes into them. This is where the lightening holes are drilled through the factory stamp on the Hex sides. Some of the drilled Hexes have no stamps at all. So it becomes super fun to collect Hexentrics, because there is no end to the variations you will come across.
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karabin museum
Trad climber
phoenix, az
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Topic Author's Reply - Sep 29, 2014 - 08:10pm PT
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I finished the Hexentric boards and another hammer board. I have to change the Camp hammer info on the board since it is not a prototype but called a Alaska Hammer. Stephane Pennequin with the NutsMuseum just sent me the motherlode of Camp catalogs. I am swimming in answers to many of my previous questions. Huge THANKS to Stephane for sure! With this info I should have a Chouinard/Camp story created soon. I am totally psyched!
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karabin museum
Trad climber
phoenix, az
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Topic Author's Reply - Sep 29, 2014 - 08:33pm PT
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When I first got the museum space at the AZ Hiking Shack, I called many glass companies to get prices to do an area 8’ tall by 15’ wide. I could not believe how much monies it was going to cost, and the heavy glass sheets being difficult to move around as well. The museum space I envisioned had to be completely modular so I could switch out the display in pieces. On a visit to Home Depot I ended up in the patio door isle and noticed a box that was discounted because it was returned and now was missing parts. The salesman there said he would give me a great deal if I wanted it. Like 50 dollars a door! I was totally psyched and stopped at two other Home Depots that day and found 6 doors total of the same model. I had to purchase them in pairs. When I got back to the Shack I placed 5 doors end to end, and they fit in the space perfectly with 1/8 inch to spare. Like it was totally made to be there!
I built a base then put a track on it which the bottom of the doors snugly fit in. The door sides butt tightly up against each other so there is no gaps. On the top of the display I built a shelf which the top of the doors rest firmly against, held in by three brackets.
The overall display is 17 boards total, and two windows which have adjustable shelves. Plus the top area section of grid wall. I have a second set of boards which I first layout the next display, and then wire the items to the boards.
The boards in the museum are set on wood tracks, and I found these cool antique brackets with an adjustable screw, which easily holds the boards in place.
So the Stopper and Hexentric boards look like this in the display case. And on the other side I added the Chouinard hammers.
I want to give a big THANKS to Art Christiansen for funding the materials to create the AZ Hiking Shack museum display case. And for his many donations over the years to the Karabin Climbing Museum. I know you don’t want me to say it, but I’m gonna say it…..Thanks Art!
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ClimbingOn
Trad climber
NY
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Sep 29, 2014 - 08:40pm PT
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That looks fantastic. Excellent work. Do you have a list of gear you're still looking for?
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karabin museum
Trad climber
phoenix, az
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Topic Author's Reply - Oct 11, 2014 - 04:01pm PT
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ClimbingOn: For Chouinard products I have a list of Items I am still looking for. Many of the items are mentioned earlier on this thread. I have a few more climbers to visit with and then I will put together my "still looking for" list.
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karabin museum
Trad climber
phoenix, az
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Topic Author's Reply - Oct 11, 2014 - 04:01pm PT
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Camp / Chouinard info
I finally got some time to look through the Mountain of Camp catalogs (digital) Stephane Pennequin sent me. Stephane you are totally awesome, huge hug!!! Looking through these catalogs I am overwhelmed on how many cool collectible pieces of gear Camp created over the years. The 1980s Camp catalogs are filled with colorful climbing tights, and all the climbing gear is florescent colors……Yes!…Those were the years! For sure the info in these catalogs answer many of my questions. The information is not complete, but I was able to piece together more history on the Chouinard Camp business relationship. Many catalogs still missing.
Camp Catalogs referenced: 1969, 1972, 1973, 1976, 1980, 1983, 1984, 1985, 1986, 1989.
……HAMMERS………………………………………………………………………..
The 1969 Camp catalog shows the Camp logo as the diamond version, but the 1972 Camp catalog shows the Camp logo as the mountain outline version. I do not have the 1970 or 1971 Camp catalogs, so sometime 1970-1972 Camp changed the logo from Diamond to Mtn outline. This does not necessarily show what date certain climbing tools were since Camp and Chouinard Piolets and Climaxe were stamped with the Camp diamond logo through 1974. The 1976 catalog shows all ice tools with Camp Mtn outline logo stamp.
Since we are already on the subject of Ice tools I found more Climaxe info. The 1973 Camp catalog shows four different wood options Camp offered for the ice tool handles. The Camp catalog shows the Climaxe available in Frassino or Bamboo handles, while Climaxes sold in the USA had Hickory handles. But this 1973 Camp catalog shows that this newer design of the Climaxe was retail store ready by late 1972. Chouinard is credited for the design of the Climaxe.
I am happy to finally find out what my Hammer/Climaxe set really is. The 1973 Camp catalog shows a Camp “Alaska” hammer, which is only available in Frassino handles. So my matching Climaxe also has a Frassino handle. Cool! But the Alaska hammer shown is a earlier version than the one I have. The teeth side of the pick is much more curved and the hole in the center of the head is larger, and stamped with Camp diamond logo. The 1976 Camp catalog shows the Alaska hammer I have with a straighter pick on teeth side, and smaller hole in center of the head, with Camp mtn outline logo stamp.
I also found more info on the Chouinard/Camp metal Alpine hammer. Chouinard is credited for the design and a “C” stamp is on the pick. The 1976 Camp catalog shows the Alpine hammer having a yellow rubber grip on handle and head is bright finish. The 1980 Camp catalog shows a Alpine Hammer with black rubber grip on the handle and head is bright finish. The 1983 Camp catalog shows the Alpine hammer having a black rubber grip on the handle and head is black.
……NUTS……………………………………………………………………….
All 1970s and 1980s Camp Exentrics and Stoppers have the “C” diamond stamp on them crediting Chouinard as the designer. The 1973 Camp catalog only shows a front view of Exentrics slung #1-7 so I am not sure if these are A-symetrical design or Polycentric. No Stoppers are listed in the catalog.
The 1976 Camp catalog shows many options available for Exentrics and Stoppers. The Exentric shape is polycentric available slung or wired. The catalog photos do not show what the mfg stamp looks like on the gear.
 Exentric set #1-11 slung
Exentric #1-6 slung with cord from mfg
Exentric #7-11 slung with cord from mfg
Exentric set #1-11 slung, all hexes anodized green
Exentric #1-5 wired
Exentric #1-5 wired, all hexes anodized green
Stopper #5-7 slung
Stopper #5-7 slung with cord from mfg
Stopper #5-7 slung, anodized colored (green?) color not shown
Stopper #1-7 wired, clear plastic wire keeper on swag
Stopper #1-7 wired, anodized colored (green?), clear plastic keeper on swag
The 1980 Camp catalog shows the Exentric mfg Stamp is “Camp” word and “Interalp” word, no Camp logo, Polycentric shape. Exentrics and Stoppers available slung or wired, red plastic carabiner loop with 2” gray plastic wire keeper on swag.
Exentric #1-5 wired
Exentric #1-11 slung
Exentric #6-11 slung with cord from mfg
Stopper #5-7 slung
Stopper #1-7 wired
The 1983 Camp catalog shows the Exentric and Stoppers having the Camp mtn outline logo stamp. Wired Exentrics and Stoppers have carabiner loop dipped in red plastic.
Exentric #1-5 wired
Exentric #1-11 slung
Exentric #6-11 slung with cord from mfg (double fisherman’s knot)
Stopper #5-7 slung
Stopper #1-7 wired
In 1984 Camp introduces Camp Speedy Nuts set of 4. In the listing the name is changed from Exentrics to Hexentrics, and Stoppers remain the same. Hexentrics and Stoppers are not listed in the 1984 catalog separately. The set of nuts offered in the catalog is only the set of 4 Speedy Nuts, or a different set composed of:
3 pieces Hexentrics wired #1, 3, 5
4 pieces Stoppers wired #1, 3, 5, 7
1 piece Hexentric slung #7
2 pieces Tri Cams #1, 2
2 pieces Two Stops #2, 4
What is also cool about the photo below is the 4 sizes of Tri Cams with springs (photo shows only three where listing shows four). I have never seen these before. Super cool! Looking at the drawn diagram I don’t necessarily trust the concept. So you place the spring Tri Cam in a half bomber position and if you fall it then jams into place? Tri Cams lock amazingly in cracks, so why lessen your chances of the pro holding by suggestively locking the nut into place?
The 1985 Camp catalog introduces Kevlar cord, but further decreases their Hexentric and Stopper selection. In the listing it has the word “Exentric” and the word “Hexentric.”
2 small sizes of Hexentrics slung,
2 medium sizes of Stoppers slung, one colored green and one colored blue (?)
4 sizes of Speedy Nuts
4 sizes of new Pentanuts
The 1986 Camp catalog reintroduces Exentrics and Stoppers. Wired Exentric and Stoppers have assorted colored plastic carabiner loops which tuck under a black plastic wire keeper on swag. The Exentrics are redesigned where the inside shape is the same as the outside shape.
The 1989 Camp catalog shows wired Exentrics and Stoppers having short colored plastic carabiner loops, and black plastic wire keeper on swag.
……PITONS………………………………………………………………………….
The 1973 Camp catalog shows the same Chouinard pitons as sold in the USA.
The 1976 Camp catalog shows the Lost Arrows having the stamp sequence (“#” over “Interalp” over “Camp”). The Angle pitons and Knifeblades are stamped “C” diamond “USA.” This catalog also shows a Super Long Dong but it is named a Nut Cracker. This long blade Lost Arrow is credited to Chouinard for the design, but it looks like the name was not completely agreed upon. So a Chouinard Super Long Dong and Camp Nut Cracker are the same item. Nut Cracker stamp lineup is (“Camp” over “Interalp”).
The 1980 Camp catalog shows Knifeblades having “Camp” stamp added to “C” diamond. Nutcracker is one word instead of two.
The 1986 and 1989 Camp catalogs show Lost Arrows are stamped (“#” over “Camp”). Nutcracker is stamped (“Camp”).
…….STUFF…………………………………………………………………
Super cool carabiner display! I wonder how many of these were made? Probably took up a little counter space in the stores. 1984 Camp catalog.
The 1986 Camp catalog shows this hang board for sale. Okay who designed this masterpiece? I sold 22 different hang boards in my old retail shop and none were compared to this. I can see why the super strong climbers were few back in the day. With training boards like this I would be scared to get into rock climbing all together. I don’t think Camp manufactured this training board due to the look of the stone, and the hex ends suggest it may be a Entre Prises product. Does anybody still have one of these still hanging in their garage? Is this possibly the first hang board created for retail sale?
Cool 1987 Camp catalog cover!
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nutstory
climber
Ajaccio, Corsica, France
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Oct 13, 2014 - 12:36am PT
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The 1973 Camp catalog only shows a front view of Exentrics slung #1-7 so I am not sure if these are A-symetrical design or Polycentric. No Stoppers are listed in the catalog. Marty, I tried to get a reply to this question from CAMP, without success. In fact, if the chocks are mentioned as Exentrics in the 1973 CAMP catalog, they are stamped Hexentric on the photograph.
You have all the early catalogs that are treasured in the CAMP factory.
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karabin museum
Trad climber
phoenix, az
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Topic Author's Reply - Oct 13, 2014 - 09:11am PT
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Stephane,
I looked at this 1973 Camp catalog photo of Exentrics twenty or so times and still never noticed that the chocks are stamped “Hexentric.” Good catch Stephane! Maybe these are the actual Chouinard brand Hexentrics before Camp created their Exentrics. The Gram weights listed includes the cord, and chocks shown are #1-7. Camp sold other Chouinard products in their catalogs, so why did Camp need to create the same Hexentrics as Chouinard, rename them for Camp, and credit the design to Chouinard anyways? Why not just sell the Chouinard Hexentrics, or maybe it weeds out the middleman for higher profit. Why didn’t Camp just redesign and create their own Exentric shape? Unless in 1973 Camp recognized Chouinard as the successful USA climbing gear manufacturer, and wanted in some way to stay partner with the name? Chouinard didn’t sell “Camp” products. But Chouinard did sell a few “Chouinard/Camp” products (ex: Piolet, Climaxe, Lost Arrow, Super Long Dong).
I like the way Camp ties off its cord for the slung Exentrics. Two separated knots create a double cord for the carabiner loop. The carabiner is the cord “point of wear” so it is doubled. Clever! I have seen this doubled construction in wired cam units, but not for cord. The double knot system may add a tiny bit more weight also. In the USA it is suggested to use a single cord with a double fisherman’s knot. On the larger chocks the single cord knot can be stuffed inside the chock as well.
Thanks again Stephane for sending me your Camp catalog surprise! Does the NutsMuseum have any 1976 Camp green Exentrics?
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nutstory
climber
Ajaccio, Corsica, France
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Oct 13, 2014 - 09:33am PT
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karabin museum
Trad climber
phoenix, az
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Topic Author's Reply - Oct 13, 2014 - 09:41am PT
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""You have all the early catalogs that are treasured in the CAMP factory.""
Stephane, Does this show that Camp did not create catalogs for years 1970, 1971, 1974, 1975, 1977, 1978, 1979 etc, or that the Camp factory did but did not archive them for their own historical records.
Your green Exentric is fantastic!!!
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scuffy b
climber
heading slowly NNW
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Oct 13, 2014 - 12:02pm PT
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The Camp cord arrangement looks cute in the pictures, but really it is just
a grapevine (double fisherman's) which is not cinched. Under any load the
two halves will just slide against each other, and the knot will be right
at the carabiner.
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karabin museum
Trad climber
phoenix, az
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Topic Author's Reply - Oct 13, 2014 - 02:47pm PT
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It is tied like this to keep the knots from sliding and to create a double cord carabiner loop.
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karabin museum
Trad climber
phoenix, az
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Topic Author's Reply - Oct 13, 2014 - 02:52pm PT
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Looking at the plastic wire keeper and carabiner loop end, these photos show many differences making it easier to figure out when the item was created. In the 1976 Camp catalog, Camp Stoppers show a clear plastic wire keeper on swag, swag is only connecting one wire. The photo does not show what the Mfg stamp looks like. The 1976 Camp wired Exentrics show a small plastic wire keeper on wires. I wonder if the 1976 Stoppers shown are actually Chouinard Stoppers. Does anybody have a Stopper stamped “Camp” that has a clear plastic wire keeper on swag like the 1976 photo shows?
The 1980 Camp catalog shows Camp changed the plastic wire keeper to a gray 2” plastic, that is sloppy on the wires. Swag is connecting one wire and short red plastic tubing added on all carabiner loops. What is strange about the 1980 Stopper shown is the number on the stamp is centered and there is no “C” diamond stamp. The back is stamped “Camp Interalp.” In the 1980 catalog photo the Stoppers have the stamp (“#” “C” centered over “Italy”)
The Mystery Stopper shows a lot of wear. There is no plastic carabiner loop, but the plastic could have broken off from usage. This Stopper has a swag crimping both wires which eliminates the use of a plastic wire keeper. Stopper stamped (#7 “C” over “Italy”) and on back is stamped “Camp.” There is no “Interalp” stamp. The Interalp stamp was dropped around 1986(?) like the Super Long Dong shows. But I believe the mystery Stopper was created sometime 1981-1982. The Mystery Stopper has a punch on the side which holds the nuts from slipping on the wires. The 1980 Camp catalog Stoppers do not have punch marks, but the 1983 Camp catalog Stoppers do. The 1983 Stopper shown is stamped (“#””C” over “Italy”)(“Camp””Interalp” on back) which puts this Stopper sometime 1982 because, the Stoppers shown in the 1983 Camp catalog are the same but have the new Camp mtn outline logo stamp. The 1983 catalog also shows the #7 having a lightening hole, where the Mystery Stopper is solid. The Mystery Stopper is possibly what 1981 Camp Stoppers looked like. But this does not explain why there is no “Interalp” stamp.
All 1983 wired Stoppers and Exentrics have carabiner loop end dipped in red plastic.
1986 Camp catalog shows all wired Stoppers and Exentrics have an assorted colored plastic carabiner loop which tucks under a black plastic wire keeper on swag.
1989 Camp catalog shows the wired Stoppers and Hexentrics have an assorted short colored thick plastic tubing carabiner loop. Black plastic wire keeper on swag.
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scuffy b
climber
heading slowly NNW
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Oct 13, 2014 - 02:53pm PT
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Oh, I see, it's really two fisherman's knots, not just the two halves
of a double fisherman's. Maybe.
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karabin museum
Trad climber
phoenix, az
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Topic Author's Reply - Oct 13, 2014 - 03:07pm PT
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I believe it is called a single Fishermans knot where the tails oppose. In some books I have seen it called a European death knot, where both tails are on the same side (for attaching two ropes together).
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scuffy b
climber
heading slowly NNW
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Oct 13, 2014 - 03:10pm PT
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It looks like your example is a ring bend (water knot) but the Camp
example looks like a fisherman's (two overhands jamming against each other). EDK is as you describe, lapped overhand.
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nutstory
climber
Ajaccio, Corsica, France
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Oct 14, 2014 - 12:36am PT
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Marty, in the seventies, CAMP did not publish a new catalog every year. At that time, a same catalog often lasted two or three years.
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SuperTopo on the Web
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Let us know!