Discussion Topic |
|
This thread has been locked |
couchmaster
climber
|
|
|
Topic Author's Original Post - Sep 9, 2018 - 10:20am PT
|
I f*#king hate thieves. In case you wonder who's been vandalizing your cars at trailheads.
Photo of one :
"The man was identified as a well-known skier named Andrew McLean. As for the woman -- she’s the Park City assistant city attorney, Polly Samuels McLean."
https://fox13now.com/2018/09/08/park-city-employee-faces-felony-charges-for-allegedly-stealing-hunters-equipment/
https://www.blackdiamondequipment.com/en_US/athlete-bio-andrew-mclean.html
"Career Highlights: As a Product Designer by profession, I was an in-house designer at Black Diamond for 13 years, where I designed the first wiregate carabiner for climbing (HotWire), Single Stem Camalots, Peckers, Talons, crampons, ice axes and skiing accessories, including a personal favorite, the Whippet Self Arrest ski pole. Through my interest in skiing and climbing, I got into ski mountaineering, and especially steep, technical couloirs. "
|
|
NutAgain!
Trad climber
South Pasadena, CA
|
|
Perhaps these are personal stands against hunting, anonymous ways of escalating a fight against something they disagree with.
I would be disinclined to think these people would also vandalize cars, but who knows. If I were a cop, I certainly would not end my search for car vandals. I just perceive different motives here. In any case, stealing stuff is not ok with me. But this could be argued as removing trash in a nature area?
|
|
Trump
climber
|
|
It’s either legal or illegal according to what the law says. If it’s illegal then it’s illegal. I’m guessing it’s probably illegal.
As far as the morality of it goes, I like the hunter who says “I think they felt that .. we’re out there just basically murdering animals, and we’re not.”
Ok, sorry mr hunter that they misunderstood your correct understanding of morality. Unfortunately, we don’t get to tell other people what their morality is. Well, we righteous folks like to do that anyway.
That said, I wouldn’t like it if I was an immoral hunter and it happened to me, either. But I wouldn’t steal their stuff either.
|
|
Jon Beck
Trad climber
Oceanside
|
|
Taking abandoned property and keeping it is not legal in a NP(United States v. Chongo), you have to turn the property over to the government. Not sure if that law that extends to all public lands.
Pretty sure they are not tweakers
|
|
monolith
climber
state of being
|
|
But is it abandoned?
Locking and putting up cameras says no.
but I bet that leaving that gear there is legal in that particular jurisdiction, else the hunters would be charged.
|
|
Splater
climber
Grey Matter
|
|
I would hope these tree stands would be illegal.
It's not private land, where automated cheating hunt methods are common.
Even if the tree stands and cameras are legal, they could be like bolts: it's legal to install them, and it's legal to remove them.
|
|
mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
|
|
If it was abandoned gear, whynhell put a chain on it? Get real!
When was the last time you heard about stolen fixed ropes?
Same unspoken message applies..."Not yours!"
The cam was a good insurance policy, IMO.
But the alleged thieves ought to have boosted that, too.
Stupidity often travels with cupidity.
|
|
fear
Ice climber
hartford, ct
|
|
Sucks.... They both made a mistake and got caught. Hopefully with clean records and full financial restitution for the hunters, they can get some kind of AR and avoid felony convictions. My $$$$ would be on a few hundred hours of community service and 2yrs probation upon which their records will be expunged.
I get it... they're trying to make a point against hunters. Unfortunately destroying property isn't the way to do that. Perhaps a better way would be to 'hike' in the vicinity with bear bells jingling while the hunters are treed. There are cameras everywhere now.... remember that!
|
|
monolith
climber
state of being
|
|
Read the article, Mouse. They took the cam that was at the site, but did not see the cams that were down the trail.
You can bet she will lose her job regardless.
|
|
mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
|
|
Oh. My bad.
|
|
JLP
Social climber
The internet
|
|
I find it hard to believe he was stealing.
McLean is well known in the climbing community. He's been around forever and has given a lot.
WTF is a non hunting couple with their income going to do with a fricken tree stand anyway?
It's far more likely that he doesn't like hunters and them leaving their sh!t all over the woods.
We'll see how the story turns out. My guess is he thinks he's in the right at some level.
Cops are typically uneducated morons. Reporting he was arrested doesn't conclude the story.
|
|
SilverSnurfer
Mountain climber
SLC, UT.
|
|
I could tag a dozen or more treestands that I've run across in the Wasatch backcountry over the last 20 years. Most I only saw because I travel more in the winter when the foliage is thinner-I'm sure that I've missed many more than I've seen in my travels in the area. 99% of the hikers will miss them completely.
As to felony theft-oh well,"do the crime, do the time" as they say.
The rich irony of climbers complaining about another user group leaving equipment in place is entertaining for a minute or so at least.
|
|
Jon Beck
Trad climber
Oceanside
|
|
From the BLM
https://www.blm.gov/download/file/fid/2077
• Use the designated spots for your tent, trailer and other gear. If you leave personal
property unattended for more than 24 hours in a day-use area, or 3 days in other areas, it
may be considered abandoned and disposed of by BLM.
BLM does not make an exception for locked gear.
|
|
Jim Clipper
climber
|
|
Seem like smart people. Something tells me that they may be fully aware of the law. Precedents? Exceptions? Way out of my league. Hope they get good representation if necessary.
|
|
SilverSnurfer
Mountain climber
SLC, UT.
|
|
//• Use the designated spots for your tent, trailer and other gear. If you leave personal
property unattended for more than 24 hours in a day-use area, or 3 days in other areas, it
may be considered abandoned and disposed of by BLM.//
I'm not sure of the status of the land they were on in this case. However-it's worth reading the above and noting "may be" and "disposed of by the BLM".
Unattended property may in fact be allowed by precedent and "Finders Keepers" mostly doesn't apply. ;)
|
|
rottingjohnny
Sport climber
Sands Motel , Las Vegas
|
|
Another witch hunt...disgraceful that hunters have accused the McLeans...the videos are fake...
|
|
SilverSnurfer
Mountain climber
SLC, UT.
|
|
Kids take heed, this is why we just say a bigly NO to meth..
|
|
rottingjohnny
Sport climber
Sands Motel , Las Vegas
|
|
Wooders rule , hunters suck...
|
|
|
SuperTopo on the Web
|
Let us know!